RES: [UA] Old groups and power

[Mario Magallanes]

DL escribió:
> 
> Ok, i usually take offense when ppl unawareness say we live in jungles or
> something, but thats ok, let me skip the South America thing... :)
> [im kidding. we still have "tribes" in reserves.]

See, actually that's my point. No matter how far you go, there are TV
sets, skyscrapers, Coca-Cola and T-shirts. It's a postmodern world,
after all. 


> 
> The problem here is it: like Winged Coyote put, some philosophical changes
> have yes, altered the IC and Statosphere. The point is: how much magic is
> dependent on it? Because it has surely change or the new magick schools
> would never happened.

That's a tough one. I'd say all magic is related to the Statosphere in
some way. Now, how changes in the statosphere affect magick depend on
the specific changes and the way the statosphere works. It's kinda like
talking about colors when you're blind.


> 
> And im tempted to agree with Michael Dinowitz, but here is the problem: the
> Statosphere and the IC, works independent of geographical cultural
> boundaries. We know they exist, but it doesnt matters much for them. Of
> course, UA is biased from our perspective. We preffer to think more
> "civilized methods" of magick works over tribal methods. And better/worst,
> the mass media magick works. :)  UA is about "civilized culture" dominating
> the globalized world to the point in wich even magick/paranormality bends to
> mass culture concepts. :) Wich is natural, since thats our background,
> right? :)

Yup. I see UA mostly as a framework, a game built around certain themes.
So I really don't mind if the cosmology is not entirely coherent,
because I don't think that's what UA is about. The cosmology is an
excuse. The themes (power and consequences, humanity, the occult and the
modern world) are what really matters. IMHO, of course.


> Anyway, the Mage: TA aproach doesnt work here. The localized cultural
> unscouncious would not prevail over the IC. What we can think over this
> aspect, is if some primeval archetypes are still around, or if the
> statosphere is fully under the IC domain, and i really dont think so...but i
> may be wrong. :)

I think that the IC is mostly in charge, and they are the ones that can
affect most the Statosphere... which is not the same thing as complete
control. Their influence is subtle.

Now, I think archetypes are primeval... mostly.  The trick is, modern
trappings become prevalent. Let's take the Hunter as an example. Hunting
animals is not as common now as it was in previous times. Even hunter
cultures (like african ones) are being pressed by governments to give up
their ways and settle as. Hunters won't disappear, as the hunting
instinct is still among us. But it's manifesting in other ways.  


> 
> And i agree with Mario. At least in part. Even if i was raised in the modern
> world, i could be raised or have been reveled to me in some early age, about
> the hermetic magick, etc, i could be an neonate from early age, and
> specially if i saw the "miracles" of its magick working, it could be alive
> thorugh me and others new blood theurgists. Right?

Frankly, I'm not sure. You'd need to have an old school teacher (a rare
commodity) and/or hermetic texts which were the real thing. I won't say
it's impossible, but you would have to avoid contamination of modern
ideas. Chances are that at some point, the school would mutate into
something different.


> 
> And talking about reality, some people are really raised by parents, with a
> very specific and strange mindset. Weird cases of misguided
> children/youngsters are not that uncommon. Some real world cults have lots
> of ppl like that.

Well, adepts have by definition, strange mindsets. Old school
mindsets... possibly, but then, they would be even more rare than normal
adepts (which at least have mundane obsessions)

Mario Magallanes
--
Save the kittens
http://home.adelphia.net/~ncavezze/sigs/kitteh2.jpg

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