[TRNSYS-users] weird Qcool
ITF - Adrien JEZEQUEL
a.jezequel at itf.biz
Tue Jun 12 23:50:13 PDT 2012
Dear Wang,
You are right : the Tcool I gave you was equal to 26, not to 24°C. Tset
value is not important as well, the most important is that you
understand how to do to define Tset.
In your model, your heating and cooling advices seem to work fine. Your
problem comes frome your internal gain : 31 people are defined all the
time in a room of approximatively 80 m², without schedule.
Because of your important internal gains, air temperature increases
until 35°C in winter. Then air temperature is refreshed because Tcool =
35°C in winter.
In summer, air is cooled at 24°C, because this is the temperature you
define in your cooling advice.
Best regards
------------------------------------------------------------------------
www.itf.biz <http://www.itf.biz>
www.itf.biz <http://www.itf.biz>
Adrien JEZEQUEL
Simulations Thermiques Dynamiques
*ITF*
62, Rue du Bolliet
73230 St Alban Leysse
FRANCE
Phone :
Fax :
Mail:
+33(0) 479 750 029
+33(0) 479 852 122
a.jezequel at itf.biz ou aj at itf.biz
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Le 12/06/2012 18:19, 王洋 a écrit :
> Dear Adrien Jezequel,
>
> Thanks for your quick reply!
> Tcool = 35 - 9 * Summer meansif in summer, Tcool = 26 °C?
>
> I tried to run the simulation based on your solutionTcool = 35 - 9 *
> Summer, the result is also like the last Attached.
> Oppositely, it is not my heating system seems to work all the time, it
> is my coolingsystem seems to work all the time.
> I set internal gains all the year.
>
> Please see the Attached *.tpf and *.bui files, if you have free time ,
> please help me have a look and give me some solutions.
>
> Many thanks in advance!
>
> Br.
>
> wang
>
>
> 2012/6/12 ITF - Adrien JEZEQUEL <a.jezequel at itf.biz
> <mailto:a.jezequel at itf.biz>>
>
> Or sorry, I made a mistake in my previous mail :
>
> * Tcool = 35 - 9 * Summer (instead of 35*winter - 9*summer)
>
> Regarding your heating system it may be something like :
>
> * Theat = 21*Winter
>
> Regarding your attached picture, your heating system seems to work
> all the time.
> In summer, either you cool at 21°C, either there is no internal
> gains defined, and you heat at 21°C.
> Check your differents inputs.
> You can procede step by step (internal gain = 0, ventilation = 0,
> infiltration rate = 0...) to see the influence of each parameters
> in your model to catch your issue.
>
> Best regards
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> www.itf.biz <http://www.itf.biz>
> www.itf.biz <http://www.itf.biz>
>
> Adrien JEZEQUEL
> Simulations Thermiques Dynamiques
> *ITF*
> 62, Rue du Bolliet
> 73230 St Alban Leysse
> FRANCE
> Phone :
> Fax :
> Mail:
> +33(0) 479 750 029
> +33(0) 479 852 122 <tel:%2B33%280%29%20479%20852%20122>
> a.jezequel at itf.biz <mailto:a.jezequel at itf.biz> ou aj at itf.biz
> <mailto:aj at itf.biz>
>
> /Afin de contribuer au respect de l'environnement, merci de
> n'imprimer cet e-mail que si nécessaire
> Please, consider our environmental responsability before printing
> this email
> /
>
> Le 12/06/2012 17:47, 王洋 a écrit :
>> Dear Adrien Jezequel,
>>
>> Many thanks!
>>
>> I think you'd better put for cooling temperatures
>>
>> * 35°C in winter (no cool) - heating temperature at 21°C
>> * 24°C in summer
>>
>> which may be translated in an equation tool by something like :
>>
>> * summer = GE(TIME,2162)*LT(TIME,6552)
>> * winter = 1 - summer
>> * Tcool = 35*Winter - 9*Summer
>>
>> For Tcool = 35*Winter - 9*Summer, do you mean if in winter, Tcool
>> = 35 °C, so Cooling doesn't work ; if in summer, Tcool = -9°C or
>> 24 °C?
>>
>> Meanwhile, another weird phenomena appear: After running based on
>> your solution in winter, indoor temperature becomes 35 °C also
>> not 21 °C, although I set heating temperature as 21 °C; in
>> summer, however, indoor temperature becomes 21 °C. Please see the
>> Attached On-Line Plotter image.
>> Furthermore, when I create another Tcool equation as
>> 35*winter+24*summer, the result is also like the Attached On-Line
>> Plotter image.
>>
>> Please give me some solutions or advices!
>> I think the point how to set that Cooling doesn't work in winter?
>> The possible reason of that problem is that I also set a
>> Mechanical Ventilation in winter (Tset=19 °C) and summer (Tset=17
>> °C). I guess Maybe the Mechanical Ventilation will influence on
>> Cooling and heating?
>>
>> Many thanks in advance!
>>
>> Br.
>>
>> wang
>>
>>
>> 2012/6/12 <trnsys-users-request at cae.wisc.edu
>> <mailto:trnsys-users-request at cae.wisc.edu>>
>>
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>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more
>> specific
>> than "Re: Contents of TRNSYS-users digest..."
>>
>> Today's Topics:
>>
>> 1. Re: TRNSYS-users Digest, Vol 90, Issue 23
>> (jose.gonzalez at imdea.org <mailto:jose.gonzalez at imdea.org>)
>> 2. Re: weird Qcool (ITF - Adrien JEZEQUEL)
>> 3. Flue gas stack in TRNSYS (Mazen Darwish)
>> 4. AutoReply: TRNSYS-users Digest, Vol 90, Issue 23
>> (kelelo1 at kelelo.com <mailto:kelelo1 at kelelo.com>)
>>
>>
>> ---------- 已转发邮件 ----------
>> From: <jose.gonzalez at imdea.org <mailto:jose.gonzalez at imdea.org>>
>> To: trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu <mailto:trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu>
>> Cc:
>> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2012 14:56:21 +0200 (CEST)
>> Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] TRNSYS-users Digest, Vol 90, Issue 23
>> I am out of the office from Monday, June 11 to Friday, June
>> 15 and unable to respond at this time.
>>
>> For any urgent matters, please contact Dr. Manuel Romero
>> (manuel.romero_at_imdea.org <http://manuel.romero_at_imdea.org>).
>>
>> Thank you for your understanding.
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> José Gonzalez-Aguilar
>>
>>
>>
>> ---------- 已转发邮件 ----------
>> From: ITF - Adrien JEZEQUEL <a.jezequel at itf.biz
>> <mailto:a.jezequel at itf.biz>>
>> To: trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu <mailto:trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu>
>> Cc:
>> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2012 15:26:28 +0200
>> Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] weird Qcool
>> Dear Wang,
>>
>> As far as I understand, the cooling set temperature you
>> define in your model is :
>>
>> * 24°C in summer, which seems to be correct
>> * and 0°C in winter... which seems to be wrong, since you
>> don't refresh your thermal zone at 0°C in winter!
>>
>> That's why you obtain huge cooling loads.
>> BAL_ENERGY is not 0 because you heat and cool in the same
>> time in winter.
>>
>> I think you'd better put for cooling temperatures
>>
>> * 35°C in winter (no cool) - heating temperature at 21°C
>> * 24°C in summer
>>
>> which may be translated in an equation tool by something like :
>>
>> * summer = GE(TIME,2162)*LT(TIME,6552)
>> * winter = 1 - summer
>> * Tcool = 35*Winter - 9*Summer
>>
>> Best regards
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> www.itf.biz <http://www.itf.biz>
>> www.itf.biz <http://www.itf.biz>
>>
>> Adrien JEZEQUEL
>> Simulations Thermiques Dynamiques
>> *ITF*
>> 62, Rue du Bolliet
>> 73230 St Alban Leysse
>> FRANCE
>> Phone :
>> Fax :
>> Mail:
>> +33(0) 479 750 029
>> +33(0) 479 852 122 <tel:%2B33%280%29%20479%20852%20122>
>> a.jezequel at itf.biz <mailto:a.jezequel at itf.biz> ou aj at itf.biz
>> <mailto:aj at itf.biz>
>>
>> /Afin de contribuer au respect de l'environnement, merci de
>> n'imprimer cet e-mail que si nécessaire
>> Please, consider our environmental responsability before
>> printing this email
>> /
>>
>> Le 12/06/2012 14:55, 王洋 a écrit :
>>> Dear all,
>>>
>>> I make a simulation. The cooling set temperature is
>>> 24*Summer schedule (2162 h to 6552 h), The heating set
>>> temperature is 21*Winter schedule (the rest hours). After
>>> running, however, it appears WEIRD phenomenon. Please see
>>> the ATTACHED Energy_zone.BAL file. During the winter period,
>>> there are Qcools and Qcool is very large up to 47000 kJ. And
>>> then it results in wrong BAL_ENERG, it is not 0.
>>>
>>> Please give me some advices and solutions to that!
>>>
>>> Many thanks in advance!
>>>
>>> Br.
>>>
>>> wang
>>>
>>> 2012/6/11 <trnsys-users-request at cae.wisc.edu
>>> <mailto:trnsys-users-request at cae.wisc.edu>>
>>>
>>> Send TRNSYS-users mailing list submissions to
>>> trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu <mailto:trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu>
>>>
>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>> https://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/listinfo/trnsys-users
>>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>>> trnsys-users-request at cae.wisc.edu
>>> <mailto:trnsys-users-request at cae.wisc.edu>
>>>
>>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>>> trnsys-users-owner at cae.wisc.edu
>>> <mailto:trnsys-users-owner at cae.wisc.edu>
>>>
>>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is
>>> more specific
>>> than "Re: Contents of TRNSYS-users digest..."
>>>
>>> Today's Topics:
>>>
>>> 1. Re: TRNSYS-users Digest, Vol 90, Issue 21
>>> (jose.gonzalez at imdea.org
>>> <mailto:jose.gonzalez at imdea.org>)
>>> 2. AutoReply: TRNSYS-users Digest, Vol 90, Issue 21
>>> (kelelo1 at kelelo.com <mailto:kelelo1 at kelelo.com>)
>>> 3. type666 (Andr?s Montero)
>>> 4. Type 673 heating problem (Santeri Siren)
>>>
>>>
>>> ---------- 已转发邮件 ----------
>>> From: <jose.gonzalez at imdea.org
>>> <mailto:jose.gonzalez at imdea.org>>
>>> To: trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu
>>> <mailto:trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu>
>>> Cc:
>>> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2012 16:07:28 +0200 (CEST)
>>> Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] TRNSYS-users Digest, Vol 90,
>>> Issue 21
>>> I am out of the office from Monday, June 11 to Friday,
>>> June 15 and unable to respond at this time.
>>>
>>> For any urgent matters, please contact Dr. Manuel Romero
>>> (manuel.romero_at_imdea.org
>>> <http://manuel.romero_at_imdea.org>).
>>>
>>> Thank you for your understanding.
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>>
>>> José Gonzalez-Aguilar
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---------- 已转发邮件 ----------
>>> From: kelelo1 at kelelo.com <mailto:kelelo1 at kelelo.com>
>>> To: trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu
>>> <mailto:trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu>
>>> Cc:
>>> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2012 14:10:47 GMT
>>> Subject: [TRNSYS-users] AutoReply: TRNSYS-users Digest,
>>> Vol 90, Issue 21
>>>
>>> I will be out of the office from June 8 - 23 on a
>>> backpacking trip with my son and his Venture Crew at
>>> Philmont Scout Ranch in New Mexico. I will not have
>>> access to email or phone service while I am gone, but I
>>> will reply to your message as soon as possible after I
>>> return to the office on Monday, June 25th.
>>>
>>> Thank you for your patience,
>>> Mark Thornbloom
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---------- 已转发邮件 ----------
>>> From: "Andrés Montero" <andresmonteroi at gmail.com
>>> <mailto:andresmonteroi at gmail.com>>
>>> To: trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu
>>> <mailto:trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu>
>>> Cc:
>>> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2012 16:57:30 +0200
>>> Subject: [TRNSYS-users] type666
>>> Dear Trnsys users,
>>>
>>> In order to simulate a water-cooled chiller, first I
>>> need to create the 2 external files for this component.
>>> I'm trying to find some catalogues with information of a
>>> 40 to 45 kW water-cooled chiller but the web pages I run
>>> into it, ask me to register, but I'm still waiting the
>>> username and pasword. Does anyone has a catalgoue with
>>> this type of info regarding this cooling capacity machine?
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>>
>>> Andrés
>>>
>>> --
>>> Andrés Montero I.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---------- 已转发邮件 ----------
>>> From: Santeri Siren <santeri.siren1 at gmail.com
>>> <mailto:santeri.siren1 at gmail.com>>
>>> To: "trnsys käyttäjät" <trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu
>>> <mailto:trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu>>
>>> Cc:
>>> Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2012 19:56:40 +0300
>>> Subject: [TRNSYS-users] Type 673 heating problem
>>> Dear all,
>>>
>>> I cant make type673 heating mode to work. Cooling mode
>>> works just fine but when I change the cooling control
>>> signal to 0 and heating control signal to 1 it doesnt
>>> work anymore. When the heating mode is used nothing
>>> happens. Does anyone know why?
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>> Santeri Siren
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> TRNSYS-users mailing list
>>> TRNSYS-users at cae.wisc.edu <mailto:TRNSYS-users at cae.wisc.edu>
>>> https://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/listinfo/trnsys-users
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> https://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/listinfo/trnsys-users
>>
>>
>> ---------- 已转发邮件 ----------
>> From: Mazen Darwish <mazentd at gmail.com
>> <mailto:mazentd at gmail.com>>
>> To: trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu <mailto:trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu>
>> Cc:
>> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2012 16:05:51 +0200
>> Subject: [TRNSYS-users] Flue gas stack in TRNSYS
>> Hello everyone ,
>> Is there a way to model a flue gas stack in TRNSYS , i need
>> to recirculate hot air and flue gases from the economizer in
>> an HRSG back to a solar tower .
>> i appreciate your ideas.
>> Mazen Darwish
>> KTH Royal Institute of Technology
>> Department of Energy Technology
>> Brinellvägen 68, SE-100 44 Stockholm, Sweden
>> Mobile: +46-(0)-723 08 18 93
>> <tel:%2B46-%280%29-723%2008%2018%2093>
>>
>>
>> ---------- 已转发邮件 ----------
>> From: kelelo1 at kelelo.com <mailto:kelelo1 at kelelo.com>
>> To: trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu <mailto:trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu>
>> Cc:
>> Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2012 14:23:03 GMT
>> Subject: [TRNSYS-users] AutoReply: TRNSYS-users Digest, Vol
>> 90, Issue 23
>>
>> I will be out of the office from June 8 - 23 on a backpacking
>> trip with my son and his Venture Crew at Philmont Scout Ranch
>> in New Mexico. I will not have access to email or phone
>> service while I am gone, but I will reply to your message as
>> soon as possible after I return to the office on Monday, June
>> 25th.
>>
>> Thank you for your patience,
>> Mark Thornbloom
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TRNSYS-users mailing list
>> TRNSYS-users at cae.wisc.edu <mailto:TRNSYS-users at cae.wisc.edu>
>> https://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/listinfo/trnsys-users
>>
>>
>
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