[TRNSYS-users] type 557a

Thu Jul 23 00:54:29 PDT 2009

Dear Matt, 

Thanks for the answer, do you have any solution for this problem? Our problem is that we are interrested in analysing the losses for specific periods of time such as comparing day and night. Is there anything we can do??
Thanks 

max

Max,

 I think  Type557 has a reporting problem. At my colleague Jeff's
suggestion, I ran your simulation out for 5 years. After about two
years, it reaches more or less steady state at which point I started
integrating the amount of energy that I was putting into the ground
(mCp(Tin-Tout)) and the amount of losses from the top sides and bottom.
The difference between the two is small and equal to the storage
internal energy change. I am not sure why Type557 only reports the
losses once every 18 hours. Jeff thinks it may have to do with the
frequency at which the solution for a single bore is superimposed on
the total bore field and then how often that solution is superimposed
upon the far field.

Kind regards,

 David

Max Werlein wrote:

  Dear all, 

We just produced a small project in order to show the effect. Pay
attention to the plots. and the period of the appearance of the losses.

Thanks to all 

max

  Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 12:39:06 -0500

From: bradley at tess-inc.com

To: maxwithhat at hotmail.com

CC: duffy at tess-inc.com

Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] type 557a

Max,

 Could you send us the project that you are working from so that we can
take a look at it?

Thanks 

David

Max Werlein wrote:

    Dear Matt,

The  problem ist not tracing the inputs, outputs and parameters. We
have been trying to debug the component 

and have encountered the problem explained before: 

" While simulating with the type 557a (Ground Heat Exchanger (TESS)) I

discouverd that the heat losses of the earth control volume to the

sides, top and bottom (Outputs: 5,6,7) are generating a peak in a

constant period (roughly 27 hours) while the rest of the time these

outputs are zero. What I actually want is an output of the losses in

every timestep. Does anyone have an idea what is actually calculated by

these outputs? Is there an error in the code?"

The problem is that the type is quite commplicated and hence we are not
able to completely understand the code!

But the results we get seem to be wrong if ever our interpretation of
the results in the online plotter are correct! 

The losses to all sides (top, bottom and side) are 0 for nearly all the
time, only for 1 timestep (after a period off roughly 27 hours) it get
a value. We have tried to understand the timestep handeling in the
code, which (if we understood well!!) seems to convert the unit hours
of the main soubroutine into seconds for the other soubroutines used,
and we suspect that there might be a mistake somewhere in the treatment
of the losses with the different time units! But as mentioned we are
not sure and we are no experts either !

Maybe some of you colleages may have an idea, 

Sorry for bothering !

Thanks 

max 

> Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 20:45:34 -0500

> Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] type 557a

> From: duffy at tess-inc.com

> To: maxwithhat at hotmail.com; trnsys-users at engr.wisc.edu

> 

> Max,

> 

> To watch outputs (and inputs and parameters) for a component, you
can use

> the TRACE feature. Simply click on the component, and then click
on the

> footprints icon on the left side of the TRNSYS Simulation Studio.
Run the

> simulation. This will print the inputs, outputs, and parameters of
that

> specific component to the listing file, *.lst. However, I am not
too

> familiar with Type557

> 

> Best regards,

> 

> Matt Duffy

> 

> 

> 

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: "Max Werlein" <maxwithhat at hotmail.com>

> Sent: Tue, July 14, 2009 12:08

> Subject:[TRNSYS-users] type 557a

> 

> 

> Dear Trnsys users,

> 

> 

> 

> While simulating with the type 557a (Ground Heat Exchanger (TESS))
I

> discouverd that the heat losses of the earth control volume to the

> sides, top and bottom (Outputs: 5,6,7) are generating a peak in a

> constant period (roughly 27 hours) while the rest of the time these

> outputs are zero. What I actually want is an output of the losses
in

> every timestep. Does anyone have an idea what is actually
calculated by

> these outputs? Is there an error in the code?

> 

> 

> 

> Thanks in advance

> 

> 

> 

> Max

> _________________________________________________________________

> Enamórate este invierno con MSN Amor y Amistad

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> TRNSYS-users mailing list

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> 

> 

> ----- End of original message -----

> 

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Partner                            Madison, WI 53703 
                                   USA
P: +1.608.274.2577 
F: +1.608.278.1475
E-mail: bradley at tess-inc.com 
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-- 
***********************************************************************
Thermal Energy System Specialists (TESS), LLC 
David BRADLEY                      22 N. Carroll Street - Suite 370 
Partner                            Madison, WI 53703 
                                   USA
P: +1.608.274.2577 
F: +1.608.278.1475
E-mail: bradley at tess-inc.com 
Web Pages:  http://www.tess-inc.com    and      http://www.trnsys.com

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