[TRNSYS-users] Heating：radiative part & ideal heating

王洋 wanghongyang1767 at gmail.com
Thu Feb 17 13:35:16 PST 2011
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Dear all,

     1.  Please tell me what's meaning of RADIATIVE PART in HEATING option?
If the heating are Radiator and Convector, how to define this RADIATIVE
PART? What's percent to set? 0 or other?

    2.  I defined a set point indoor temperature:20C from 8 am to 6 pm,
other time is 18 C in the test room . I used the HEATING to realize it, but
the heating is ideal heating. Please tell me what's the meaning of ideal
heating?

  The result is the indoor temperature can get to the set point at once and
no time delay, so I cann't get the THERMAL TIME CONSTANT of the test room.
But my professor let me use TRNSYS to verify the result of using TRNSYS to
calculate the time constant and actual measurement test room result of time
constant. Please tell me how to get the thermal time constant of the test
room using TRNSYS? Or how to explain to my professor the ideal heating?

Many thanks!

br.

wang



2011/2/17 <trnsys-users-request at cae.wisc.edu>

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> Today's Topics:
>
>   1. Re: PV Powered electrical heat pump (David BRADLEY)
>   2. Re: length and witdh from the collector area (David BRADLEY)
>   3. Re: type2b Controller (David BRADLEY)
>   4. WALL TRANSFERFUNCTION CALCULATIONS &TIMEBASE (??)
>
>
> ---------- 已转发邮件 ----------
> From: David BRADLEY <d.bradley at tess-inc.com>
> To: gzlv <gzlv at sjtu.edu.cn>
> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2011 16:11:13 -0600
> Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] PV Powered electrical heat pump
> Guangzhao,
>   You will find various heat pump models (air-to-air, water-to-air,
> air-to-water, and water-to-water) in the TESS HVAC Library. I would
> recommend running your Type56 building in temperature level control instead
> of letting it calculate cooling load. You'll need a thermostat model to turn
> on and off the heat pump but then your heat pump model will report the
> required power, which you can match up to your PV array output. You may need
> some battery storage in case your cooling load does not match up perfectly
> with the electricity supplied by your PV.
> Kind regards,
>  David
>
>
> On 2/16/2011 01:57, gzlv wrote:
>
> Hello, I am trying to model a PV powered air conditioning system. I want to
> know which type can be treated as an electrical heat pump that can
> get cooling load and heating load from type 56. I want to conect it with
> type 48.
>
> 2011-02-16
> ------------------------------
>  Guangzhao Lv
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TRNSYS-users mailing listTRNSYS-users at cae.wisc.eduhttps://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/listinfo/trnsys-users
>
>
> --
> ***************************
> David BRADLEY
> Principal
> Thermal Energy Systems Specialists, LLC
> 22 North Carroll Street - suite 370
> Madison, WI  53703 USA
>
> P:+1.608.274.2577
> F:+1.608.278.1475d.bradley at tess-inc.com
> http://www.tess-inc.comhttp://www.trnsys.com
>
>
>
> ---------- 已转发邮件 ----------
> From: David BRADLEY <d.bradley at tess-inc.com>
> To: "Sancho,Fernando" <fsancho at sonnenwaermeag.de>
> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2011 16:38:24 -0600
> Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] length and witdh from the collector area
> Fernando,
>   I think you'd be best off trying different combinations of modules in
> series and in parallel. I do not know of any flat-plate collector models
> that allow you to specify the panel length. Most of them rely on a quadratic
> efficiency curve that is typically experimentally determined for a given
> collector configuration. They do not do first-principals computations of the
> collector fin efficiency equations. If you are looking for a reference that
> will give you information on how to compute such things, I would recommend
> "Solar Engineering of Thermal Processes"
> Regards,
>  David
>
>
> On 2/16/2011 04:48, Sancho,Fernando wrote:
>
>  Hello TRNSYS-users,
>
>
>
> I’m making simulations with plastic collector. Many from the commercial
> models can be resized, so it’s almost free how to configurate the collector
> area. I would like to find  an optimal distribution, dependent of course on
> Radiation, temperatures etc…, basically how long and width for a minimum
> output temperature of  the fluid. Or just what is the best for a certain
> situation 10m*30m or 30m*10m ?.
>
> I ´ve already done my calculations with Excel and know that longer means
> higher output temperature but lower energy gain… but with trnsys  it’s
> difficult to face the problem ,
>
> do I take a standard unit and probe around different series und parallel
> distributions L ?
>
> Do type 553 and 559 in TESS TRn17 do that; difference width and length (I
> didn’t find it in the general pdf… and have just occasionally access to
> TRNSYS17)?
>
> Any advice or experience?
>
>
>
> So Thanks a lot!!!!!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Mit freundlichen Grüßen
>
> Fernando Sancho Márquez
>
> PHÖNIX SonnenWärme AG
>
> ____________________________________________
> PHÖNIX Sonnenwärme AG
> Ostendstr. 1
>
> D-12459 Berlin
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> TRNSYS-users mailing listTRNSYS-users at cae.wisc.eduhttps://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/listinfo/trnsys-users
>
>
> --
> ***************************
> David BRADLEY
> Principal
> Thermal Energy Systems Specialists, LLC
> 22 North Carroll Street - suite 370
> Madison, WI  53703 USA
>
> P:+1.608.274.2577
> F:+1.608.278.1475d.bradley at tess-inc.com
> http://www.tess-inc.comhttp://www.trnsys.com
>
>
>
> ---------- 已转发邮件 ----------
> From: David BRADLEY <d.bradley at tess-inc.com>
> To: Hanani Abd Wahab <ha65 at waikato.ac.nz>
> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2011 16:06:48 -0600
> Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] type2b Controller
> Hanani,
> I know nothing about programming in Simulink but you can probably take a
> look at the source code for type2 (c:\TrnsysXX\SourceCode\Types\Type2.for)
> using a text editor and understand better how it makes use of the inputs.
> regards,
> David
>
>
> On 2/15/2011 21:55, Hanani Abd Wahab wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I am trying to build the same type2b controller in Simulink. What I
>> understand is I can create using simple relay control in Simulink
>> model.In relay model, I just set switch on point 10, switch off point
>> 2 (as same as dead band  value in TRNSYS). 'Th' I set as input to
>> relay. But how about Tl and Tin? In type2b there is 6 inputs consist
>> of Th,Tl,Tin, Input control function , Upper dT dan Lower dT.
>>
>> Really appreciate any help or idea...
>>
>> Thanks&  Regards
>>
>>
> --
> ***************************
> David BRADLEY
> Principal
> Thermal Energy Systems Specialists, LLC
> 22 North Carroll Street - suite 370
> Madison, WI  53703 USA
>
> P:+1.608.274.2577
> F:+1.608.278.1475
> d.bradley at tess-inc.com
>
> http://www.tess-inc.com
> http://www.trnsys.com
>
>
>
>
> ---------- 已转发邮件 ----------
> From: 王洋 <wanghongyang1767 at gmail.com>
> To: trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu
> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2011 18:21:44 +0100
> Subject: [TRNSYS-users] WALL TRANSFERFUNCTION CALCULATIONS &TIMEBASE
> Dear all,
>
> I met this error:
>
>
>           ***** WALL TRANSFERFUNCTION CALCULATIONS *****
>
>  UNABLE TO FIND A ROOT AFTER INDICATION THAT A ROOT EXISTED
>
>  CHECK THE WALL TYPE AFTER THE LAST CALCULATED WALL
>  OFTEN THE WALL CAPACITY IS TO SMALL TO CALCULATE A TRANSFER FUNCTION !
>
>  CHECK ALSO YOUR TIMEBASE !
>
>
>
> Attached is INF file, Please check it!
>
>
> And I make the timebase larger, but it still doesn't work.
>
> Many thanks!
>
> Br.
>
> wang
>
>
>
> 2011/2/16 <trnsys-users-request at cae.wisc.edu>
>
>> Send TRNSYS-users mailing list submissions to
>>        trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu
>>
>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>        https://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/listinfo/trnsys-users
>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>>        trnsys-users-request at cae.wisc.edu
>>
>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>>        trnsys-users-owner at cae.wisc.edu
>>
>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> than "Re: Contents of TRNSYS-users digest..."
>>
>> Today's Topics:
>>
>>   1. length and witdh from the collector area (Sancho,Fernando)
>>   2. Re: g95 compiler (Francois Badinier)
>>
>>
>> ---------- 已转发邮件 ----------
>> From: "Sancho,Fernando" <fsancho at sonnenwaermeag.de>
>> To: <trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu>
>> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2011 11:48:55 +0100
>> Subject: [TRNSYS-users] length and witdh from the collector area
>>
>> Hello TRNSYS-users,
>>
>>
>>
>> I’m making simulations with plastic collector. Many from the commercial
>> models can be resized, so it’s almost free how to configurate the collector
>> area. I would like to find  an optimal distribution, dependent of course on
>> Radiation, temperatures etc…, basically how long and width for a minimum
>> output temperature of  the fluid. Or just what is the best for a certain
>> situation 10m*30m or 30m*10m ?.
>>
>> I ´ve already done my calculations with Excel and know that longer means
>> higher output temperature but lower energy gain… but with trnsys  it’s
>> difficult to face the problem ,
>>
>> do I take a standard unit and probe around different series und parallel
>> distributions L ?
>>
>> Do type 553 and 559 in TESS TRn17 do that; difference width and length (I
>> didn’t find it in the general pdf… and have just occasionally access to
>> TRNSYS17)?
>>
>> Any advice or experience?
>>
>>
>>
>> So Thanks a lot!!!!!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen
>>
>> Fernando Sancho Márquez
>>
>> PHÖNIX SonnenWärme AG
>>
>> ____________________________________________
>> PHÖNIX Sonnenwärme AG
>> Ostendstr. 1
>>
>> D-12459 Berlin
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ---------- 已转发邮件 ----------
>> From: "Francois Badinier" <francois.badinier at icax.co.uk>
>> To: <mabadie at univ-lr.fr>, <trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu>
>> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2011 15:02:13 -0000
>> Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] g95 compiler
>> Marc
>>
>> If you still want to use g95, an alternative is to define T0, Tfinal and
>> Timestep as parameters in our new component. The only drawback is that you
>> have to be careful to change those values whenever you change them in the
>> simulation studio.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> François Badinier
>> Development Engineer
>> ICAX Ltd
>> 1 Berry Street
>> London EC1M 5PS
>> francois.badinier at icax.co.uk
>> www.icax.co.uk
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: trnsys-users-bounces at cae.wisc.edu
>> [mailto:trnsys-users-bounces at cae.wisc.edu] On Behalf Of
>> mabadie at univ-lr.fr
>> Sent: 14 February 2011 11:57
>> To: trnsys-users at cae.wisc.edu
>> Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] g95 compiler
>>
>> Danny and David,
>>
>> I actually successfully used the G95 compiler with TRNSYS 16 to create
>> new components. However, i was not able to properly used TRNSYS
>> variables (such as getSimulationTime()) in my TYPES. The only solution
>> i found was to stop using this compiler and buying Intel Fortran v11.
>>
>> I hope you will find a way to fix that problem as it is nice to have
>> the choice of a free/light fortran compiler.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> -- Marc O. Abadie
>>
>>
>> David BRADLEY <d.bradley at tess-inc.com> a écrit :
>>
>> > Danny,
>> >   getSimulationTime is a function that is defined in the data module
>> > called "TrnsysFunctions." When compiling an external Type in either
>> > the Compaq or the Intel compilers, I have to make sure that the
>> > compiler is set to look for data modules (sometimes called MOD
>> > files) in the ..\Trnsys17\Compilers\IVF111\Debug\ directory or else
>> > copy them to some other place where they can be found by the
>> > compiler. My understanding is that this tells the compiler "don't
>> > worry, even though I haven't defined this function called
>> > getSimulationTime() in my external Type242.dll, you'll find that
>> > function during run-time because my dll will be called by a dll in
>> > which the function is defined"
>> >
>> >   I don't know how the G95 compiler handles settings for where to
>> > look for *.mod files but this is not specific to Trnsys17, there
>> > were a number of TrnsysFunctions called by Types in Trnsys16 as
>> > well. We have just expanded their use in Trnsys17.
>> > best,
>> >  David
>> >
>> >
>> > On 2/11/2011 11:12, Danny Jonas wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Dear TRNSYS users,
>> >>
>> >> I have use the directions in the document, but after starting the
>> >> batch file to compile my own type I've received the following
>> >> message:
>> >>
>> >> "In file Type201.for:72
>> >>
>> >>                Time=getSimulationTime<>
>> >>
>> >> Error: Function 'getsimulationtime' at <1> has no implicit type"
>> >>
>> >> could the error be associated with using TRNSYS17?
>> >>
>> >> Using the example (type242), I can build the type242.dll.
>> >>
>> >> I'm now trying to use C++, till now it works fine. But I still
>> >> don't understand why it doesn't work with the batch file as fortran
>> >> code....
>> >>
>> >> Thanks a lot,
>> >>
>> >> Best Regards,
>> >>
>> >> Danny
>> >>
>> >> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
>> >>
>> >> Von: Daniel Bergey [mailto:daniel at buildingscience.com]
>> >>
>> >> Gesendet: Mittwoch, 9. Februar 2011 21:14
>> >>
>> >> An: Danny Jonas
>> >>
>> >> Betreff: Re: [TRNSYS-users] g95 compiler
>> >>
>> >> I have successfully compiled a couple of components using
>> >> directions in the attached document.  I don't recall the URL whence
>> >> I downloaded it originally.  Sorry about the doc format; let me
>> >> know if I should convert it.
>> >>
>> >> Daniel
>> >>
>> >> On Fri, Feb 04, 2011 at 01:33:49PM +0100, Danny Jonas wrote:
>> >>
>> >>>    Dear TRNSYS users,
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>    I want to use the free g95 compiler to create my own components
>> >>> in TRNSYS.
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>    I have found the following message in the TRNSYS-users Archives:
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>> [1]
>> http://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/pipermail/trnsys-users/2008/003957.html
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>    with the following link:
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>    [2]http://software.cstb.fr/main/articles.asp?langue=us
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>    But this page no longer exists.
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>    Can someone send a link where I can download this example?
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>    Thanks in advance,
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>    Danny
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>> References
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>>    Visible links
>> >>
>> >>>    1.
>> http://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/pipermail/trnsys-users/2008/003957.html
>> >>
>> >>>    2. http://software.cstb.fr/main/articles.asp?langue=us
>> >>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>
>> >>> TRNSYS-users mailing list
>> >>
>> >>> TRNSYS-users at cae.wisc.edu <mailto:TRNSYS-users at cae.wisc.edu>
>> >>
>> >>> https://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/listinfo/trnsys-users
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> TRNSYS-users mailing list
>> >> TRNSYS-users at cae.wisc.edu
>> >> https://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/listinfo/trnsys-users
>> >
>> > --
>> > ***************************
>> > David BRADLEY
>> > Principal
>> > Thermal Energy Systems Specialists, LLC
>> > 22 North Carroll Street - suite 370
>> > Madison, WI  53703 USA
>> >
>> > P:+1.608.274.2577
>> > F:+1.608.278.1475
>> > d.bradley at tess-inc.com
>> >
>> > http://www.tess-inc.com
>> > http://www.trnsys.com
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TRNSYS-users mailing list
>> TRNSYS-users at cae.wisc.edu
>> https://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/listinfo/trnsys-users
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TRNSYS-users mailing list
>> TRNSYS-users at cae.wisc.edu
>> https://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/listinfo/trnsys-users
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> https://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/listinfo/trnsys-users
>
>
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