Dear all,<br><br>I have a question about *.BUI file. I create a project with about 30 zones using TRNSYS 16.<br>Before I created the seventeenth zone using the same exterior wall and floor as well as interior wall etc for the project, it worked well. But when the seventeenth zone created, it appeared an ERROR in TRNBuild: <span style="color:rgb(51,51,255)">Error creating the wall transfer function coeffients</span>. Please see the attached figure. The second file is its INF file.<br>
<br>If you had some relative experience, PLEASE tell me how to solve with this problem.<br><br>Thanks in advance!<br>Br.<br><br>wang<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2012/11/12 <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:trnsys-users-request@cae.wisc.edu" target="_blank">trnsys-users-request@cae.wisc.edu</a>></span><br>
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<br>Today's Topics:<br>
<br>
1. Re: Type 15-2: Relationship between data arrangements,<br>
simulation times and convergence (David BRADLEY)<br>
2. simulation trend opposite to reality (validation)<br>
(Karol Bandurski)<br>
<br><br>---------- 已转发邮件 ----------<br>From: David BRADLEY <<a href="mailto:d.bradley@tess-inc.com">d.bradley@tess-inc.com</a>><br>To: Flynn Ciaran <<a href="mailto:ciaran.flynn@aalto.fi">ciaran.flynn@aalto.fi</a>><br>
Cc: "<a href="mailto:trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu">trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu</a>" <<a href="mailto:trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu">trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu</a>><br>Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2012 11:09:38 -0600<br>Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] Type 15-2: Relationship between data arrangements, simulation times and convergence<br>
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
<span lang="EN-US">Ciarán,<br>
Option 1) is incorrect. Type15 is intended to be used with
year-long weather files that have a 1-hour data interval. The
component knows from the simulation start and stop time what day
of the year it is, so if you trick it by setting the simulation
start time to hour zero and rearrange the weather file to start in
the middle of the year, what the Type calculates about the sunup
and sundown times and what the data file says is happening are not
going to match at all. Option 2 is the only correct one.<br>
Best,<br>
David<br>
<br>
<br>
</span>
<div>On 11/12/2012 06:32, Flynn Ciaran
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Hello,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">I have a couple of
questions concerning the relationship between the
arrangement of data in TMY2 weather files, TRNSYS simulation
times and convergence errors. I tried looking at the source
code but I could not figure out the answer..<br>
I am running a simulation for one year, using Type 15-2 for
weather, starting at 1h on July 1<sup>st</sup> and ending at
24h on June 30<sup>th</sup>. This leaves me with two
options:
<br>
1) Either I rearrange the tm2 file to start at 1h on the 1<sup>st</sup>
of July and end at 24h on June 30<sup>th</sup>, and set the
simulation start and stop times to 0 and 8760h respectively,
or
<br>
2) Either I leave the weather file as it is and set the
simulation start and stop times at 4344h and 13104h
respectively.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">When I use a provided
weather file (e.g. CA-BC-Vancouver-718920.tm2) and set the
simulation time step at 0.1h, I get the following:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<table style="border-collapse:collapse;border:none" border="1" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td style="width:42.15pt;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt" valign="top" width="56">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span lang="EN-US"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="width:106.3pt;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;border-left:none;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt" width="142">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span lang="EN-US">Failed convergence
time steps<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="width:184.3pt;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;border-left:none;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt" width="246">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span lang="EN-US">Time steps where:
<br>
calculated total horizontal radiation >
horizontal extraterrestrial radiation<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="width:120.45pt;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;border-left:none;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt" width="161">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span lang="EN-US">Time steps where:
<br>
direct normal radiation > solar constant<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="width:177.2pt;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;border-left:none;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt" width="236">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span lang="EN-US">Time steps where:
<br>
calculated horizontal beam radiation > total
horizontal radiation<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="width:42.15pt;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;border-top:none;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt" valign="top" width="56">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span lang="EN-US">1)<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="width:106.3pt;border-top:none;border-left:none;border-bottom:solid windowtext 1.0pt;border-right:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt" width="142">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span lang="EN-US">7719<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="width:184.3pt;border-top:none;border-left:none;border-bottom:solid windowtext 1.0pt;border-right:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt" width="246">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span lang="EN-US">10664<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="width:120.45pt;border-top:none;border-left:none;border-bottom:solid windowtext 1.0pt;border-right:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt" width="161">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span lang="EN-US">124<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="width:177.2pt;border-top:none;border-left:none;border-bottom:solid windowtext 1.0pt;border-right:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt" width="236">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span lang="EN-US">3498<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="width:42.15pt;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt;border-top:none;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt" valign="top" width="56">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span lang="EN-US">2)<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="width:106.3pt;border-top:none;border-left:none;border-bottom:solid windowtext 1.0pt;border-right:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt" width="142">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span lang="EN-US">6424<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="width:184.3pt;border-top:none;border-left:none;border-bottom:solid windowtext 1.0pt;border-right:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt" width="246">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span lang="EN-US">-<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="width:120.45pt;border-top:none;border-left:none;border-bottom:solid windowtext 1.0pt;border-right:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt" width="161">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span lang="EN-US">-<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="width:177.2pt;border-top:none;border-left:none;border-bottom:solid windowtext 1.0pt;border-right:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt" width="236">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center"><span lang="EN-US">13<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">So my question are:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-US"><span>-<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><span lang="EN-US">Why
is TRNSYS giving different error messages if the same
weather data are used ? (I believe that there are no other
types in my file that could explain the reason for this)<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-US"><span>-<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><span lang="EN-US">What
parameters do the radiation values calculated by TRNSYS
depend on and how are they calculated?
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-US"><span>-<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><span lang="EN-US">What
is the best approach in this situation (minimal radiation
errors)?<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Thanks a lot,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Ciarán<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-US"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
</div>
<br>
<fieldset></fieldset>
<br>
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</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
<pre cols="72">--
***************************
David BRADLEY
Principal
Thermal Energy Systems Specialists, LLC
22 North Carroll Street - suite 370
Madison, WI 53703 USA
P:<a href="tel:%2B1.608.274.2577" value="+16082742577" target="_blank">+1.608.274.2577</a>
F:<a href="tel:%2B1.608.278.1475" value="+16082781475" target="_blank">+1.608.278.1475</a>
<a href="mailto:d.bradley@tess-inc.com" target="_blank">d.bradley@tess-inc.com</a>
<a href="http://www.tess-inc.com" target="_blank">http://www.tess-inc.com</a>
<a href="http://www.trnsys.com" target="_blank">http://www.trnsys.com</a></pre>
</div>
<br><br>---------- 已转发邮件 ----------<br>From: "Karol Bandurski" <<a href="mailto:karol.bandurski@put.poznan.pl">karol.bandurski@put.poznan.pl</a>><br>To: <<a href="mailto:trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu">trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu</a>>, <<a href="mailto:bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org">bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org</a>><br>
Cc: <br>Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2012 18:22:45 +0100<br>Subject: [TRNSYS-users] simulation trend opposite to reality (validation)<br><div link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="EN-US"><div><p class="MsoNormal">Dear All,<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">I simulate the dwelling in TRNSYS. Last time a try to validate my model and I compare simulation results with measurements.<u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">
<b><u>Heat consumption</u></b> has been measured in dwelling every week (the same day of week and the same hour).<u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">Trnsys simulation generate results for dwelling’s model with ideal heating assumptions (set temperature 20/21) –NTYPE2 (sensible <b><u>energy demand</u></b>).<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">Total <b><u>heat consumption (measurements)</u></b> of dwelling and <b><u>energy demand (simulation)</u></b> of simulated model are quite similar (36 weeks from September to June), but if we look on weekly results there are bigger difference with interesting regularity:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">if <b><u>heat consumption</u></b> decreases from one week to the next, then <b><u>energy demand</u></b> increase, and vice versa (I enclose graph).<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">Could you tell me what can cause this lack of coincidence?<u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">I will be grateful for any hints!<u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">
<u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">Regards,<u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">Karol<u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">------------------------------------------------<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Karol Bandurski MSc.<u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="background:white" lang="PL"><a href="http://www.ee.put.poznan.pl/" target="_blank"><span style="color:windowtext;text-decoration:none" lang="EN-US">Institute of Environmental Engineering</span></a></span><span style="background:white"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="background:white">Poznan University of Technology<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="background:white" lang="PL"><a href="http://www.ee.put.poznan.pl/" target="_blank"><span style="color:blue" lang="EN-US">www.ee.put.poznan.pl</span></a></span><span style="background:white"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="background:white" lang="PL"><a href="http://www.put.poznan.pl/" target="_blank"><span style="color:blue">www.put.poznan.pl</span></a><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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