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<p class=MsoPlainText>Mehdi, Javier, and Jochen,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal>We recently experienced some good cooperation on different
projects from Broad & Thermax that is worth mentioning. For one of our
solar cooling projects I had estimated the hot water temperature range that we
could supply to the absorption chiller, based on the outlet temperatures of glycol-mix
from the solar collectors. Then according to the external data file format for
Type 107, I had prepared an excel sheet specifying the parameter boundaries,
the chilled water, cooling water, & hot water inlet temperatures. The Thermax
rep then filled out the performance data using their in-house software that
David mentioned in his email. Same thing with Broad – I did receive the data
files from them for two of their models for our CHP projects.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal>Having said that, I have to admit that it takes a lot of
persistence & patience on our side – repeated emails & phone
calls to get this done. Plus, you have to be sympathetic when you hear quite a
few complaints about the number of runs they need to do to fill out the data. Also,
there is no guarantee that you could count on the goodness of their hearts the
next time you need data for another model! <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal>Good luck!<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Medium Cond","sans-serif"'>Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Medium Cond","sans-serif"'>Ratnalee
Patil<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Medium Cond","sans-serif"'>B.Arch.,
M.A.Sc. Engineering<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Medium Cond","sans-serif"'>Sustainable
Design Analyst<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Medium Cond","sans-serif";
color:#17365D'>I</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Medium Cond","sans-serif";
color:#17365D'>nnovative </span><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Medium Cond","sans-serif";
color:#17365D'>D</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Medium Cond","sans-serif";
color:#17365D'>esign<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Medium Cond","sans-serif";
color:#3366FF'>850 West Morgan St.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Medium Cond","sans-serif";
color:#3366FF'>Raleigh, NC 27603</span><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:
"Berlin Sans FB","sans-serif";color:#3366FF'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Medium Cond","sans-serif";
color:#3366FF'>Ph: (919) 832-6303<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Medium Cond","sans-serif";
color:#3366FF'>Fax: (919) 832-3339<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Medium Cond","sans-serif";
color:#17365D'><a href="http://www.innovativedesign.net/"><span
style='color:#17365D'>www.innovativedesign.net</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>-----Original Message-----<br>
From: David BRADLEY [mailto:d.bradley@tess-inc.com] <br>
Sent: Thursday, September 08, 2011 3:52 PM<br>
To: jochen.doell@ise.fraunhofer.de<br>
Cc: trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu<br>
Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] Type 107 hot water absorption chiller- catalogue to
develope a data file<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>Mehdi, Javier, and Jochen,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText> I have run into the same trouble with
manufacturers as well. I have <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>the impression that they are moving away from printed
catalogs with <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>standard operating points and they are moving towards
developing their <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>own in-house software tools that make a machine selection
based on <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>expected operating points. If you (or the manufacturer's
rep) run that <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>software enough times with different operating points
covering the <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>entire range of expected inlet conditions, you can
generate that <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>necessary maps. Getting access to that software is nearly
impossible though.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>Best,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText> David<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>On 9/8/2011 01:21, Jochen Doell wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>> Dear Mehdi, dear Javier,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>> I faced this problem a few times and I am pretty
annoyed with the <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>> companies behaviour.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>> Anyway, there is a model available written by Jan
Albers which uses <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>> the characteristic equation ("ddT") by
Prof. Felix Ziegler. This model <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>> accounts for part load behaviour.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>> See this Email to retrieve the link:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>
https://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/pipermail/trnsys-users/2010/005720.html<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>> Parameters are included for the old version of the
Yazaki WFC10 <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>> (bubble pump).<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>> If you have measured data at hand, you can calculate
the needed <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>> parameters to simulate other absorption chillers
like the new WFC10.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>> Best regards,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>> Jochen<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>> Am 20:59, schrieb Javier Galvan Villamarin:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> Hi Mehdi,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> I have been working on the type 107. I agree
with you. The <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> manufactures do not provide the needed
information. I talked to <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> people in Yazaky and York and it was not
possible. However, I managed <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> to find some extra data from Yazaky. See the
attached files.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> I would like to talk to you in order to share
some opinions about <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> input data for diferent load levels of the
chiller operation.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> Please let me know if we can talk to work
together on the type-107 as <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> well as other Types for chillers simulation.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> Best regards,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> Javier Galvan<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> ________________________________<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> From: trnsys-users-bounces@cae.wisc.edu <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> [trnsys-users-bounces@cae.wisc.edu] on behalf of
Mehdi Shahrestani <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> [mahdishahrestani@yahoo.com]<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2011 12:31 AM<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> To: trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> Subject: [TRNSYS-users] Type 107 hot water
absorption chiller- <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> catalogue to develope a data file<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> Dear TRNSYS users<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> I am working of type 107 hot water absorption
chiller (single/double <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> effect).<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> For developing data file reviewed most of the
manufacturer catalogues <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> ( Trane, Carrier, Hitachi, Yazaki,….)<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> But except Yazaki, none of them provides
“Capacity Factor” and “Heat <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> Input Factor”.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> Yazaki only provides this information for
specific chilled water <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> temperature 44C, Where as to develop a data file
more chilled water <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> point should be inserted.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> I was wondering if anybody knows about a
catalogue which provides <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> such and information.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> Thanks for the time you spent on this request.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>> Mehdi Shahrestani<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>-- <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>***************************<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>David BRADLEY<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>Principal<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>Thermal Energy Systems Specialists, LLC<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>22 North Carroll Street - suite 370<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>Madison, WI 53703 USA<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>P:+1.608.274.2577<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>F:+1.608.278.1475<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>d.bradley@tess-inc.com<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>http://www.tess-inc.com<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText>http://www.trnsys.com<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
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