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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Dear Ayman,<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>do you mean the 4th input
of Type 56 TSGRD?<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>This temperature input is
used for longwave radiation exchange of an external surfaces with the environment.
<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>The environment is
divided into 2 parts <o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>- the sky presented by a sky
temperature TSKY and the view factor to the sky FSKY and<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>- the “non-sky”
part called ground presented by a ground temperature TSGRD and the view factor
1-FSKY.<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>If the building is
surrounded by other buildings the walls doesn’t “see” the
ground that much but the other buildings.<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>In this case TSGRD should
represent the surface temperature of the other buildings.<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on"><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Arial;color:navy'>Marion</span></font></st1:City></st1:place><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Arial;color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color="#005a00" face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:#005A00;font-weight:bold'>Dipl.-Ing.
<st1:PersonName w:st="on">Marion Hiller</st1:PersonName> </span></font></b><b><font
size=2 color="#009900"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#009900;font-weight:
bold'><br>
</span></font></b><b><font size=2 color="#007000" face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:#007000;font-weight:bold'>TRANSSOLAR:
KlimaEngineering - Technologien für energieeffizientes Bauen und Nutzerkomfort
in Gebäude </span></font></b><b><font size=1 color="#005a00" face=Arial><span
style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Arial;color:#005A00;font-weight:bold'><br>
Munich - New York - Stuttgart + 49.711.67976.0 <br>
<br>
</span></font></b><b><font size=1 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;font-weight:bold'>Transsolar
Energietechnik GmbH, Curiestrasse 2, 70563 Stuttgart <br>
Amtsgericht Stuttgart - HRB 23347, Steuernummer 99073/00911, USt-IdNr.:
DE152272639</span></font></b><font color=navy><span style='color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=1 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;font-weight:bold'>Geschäftsführer:
Dipl.Ing. Matthias Schuler, Dipl.Ing. Thomas Auer, Dipl.Phys. <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">Stefan Holst</st1:PersonName>, Prof. Dipl.-Ing. Bleicher <o:p></o:p></span></font></b>
</p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=navy face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy'> <o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</p>
<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>Von:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> Ayman Sarwa
[mailto:aymaneldakhl@yahoo.com] <br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Gesendet:</span></b> Samstag, 6. August 2011
12:20<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>An:</span></b> David BRADLEY; <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Betreff:</span></b> Re: [TRNSYS-users]
Boundary wall</span></font><o:p></o:p>
</p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</p>
<div>
<div>
<p style='background:white'><font size=3 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Thanks David <o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><font size=3 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><font size=3 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>But ,
what is the importance or function of Tground as an Input in Type 56 ?<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><font size=3 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
<div>
<blockquote style='margin-left:12.0pt;margin-top:12.0pt;margin-right:12.0pt;
margin-bottom:12.0pt' type=cite>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span
class=yiv773644300apple-style-spanyui32051312621987551165><font size=3
color=black face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;
color:black'>------</span></font></span><font color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><font size=3 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'>Best
Regadrs</span></font><font color=black face=Arial><span style='font-family:
Arial;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><font size=3 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'>Eng.
Ayman Mohamed</span></font><font color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><font size=3 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center;background:white'><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'>
<hr size=1 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white'><b><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> David
BRADLEY <d.bradley@tess-inc.com><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> Ayman Sarwa
<aymaneldakhl@yahoo.com><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></b> "<st1:PersonName w:st="on">trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu</st1:PersonName>"
<<st1:PersonName w:st="on">trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu</st1:PersonName>><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Friday, August 5, 2011 10:44
PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [TRNSYS-users]
Boundary wall</span></font><font color=black><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
<div id=yiv773644300>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Ayman,<br>
I am not sure that I follow quite what you are doing. If your floor is
defined as a BOUNDARY and the back side temperature is set to identical then
that defines an air temperature on the other side of the floor as being
identical to the air temperature of your zone. You can't then define the back
side temperature as a ground temperature; that would doubly define the
temperature on the other side of the floor. <br>
<br>
Best,<br>
David<br>
<br>
On 8/5/2011 09:50, Ayman Sarwa wrote: <o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><font size=3 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>I am
simulating single zone by Trnbuild and Trnsys 17, I define the floor as <b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>boundary </span></b>and select boundary as <b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>identical </span></b>when I read the energy
from inside surf. of floor conv. to air and
longwave radiation to other surfaces = NTYPE19 the QCOMI of
floor, and Temp. of inside floor, I note that, <o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><font size=3 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>for all
cases when I define the ground Temp i.e Input of type 56 by type 77 (ground
temp ) or by const value , the QCOMI always keeps +ve while T sur_in < T
zone, i.e the energy transfer from air zone to floor , but <span
class=yiv773644300apple-style-span>QCOMI must be -ve, <b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>Why </span></b>?</span><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span
class=yiv773644300apple-style-span><font size=3 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Any one can help me to
Know what is happen ?</span></font></span><font color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span
class=yiv773644300apple-style-span><font size=3 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>thanks</span></font></span><font
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span
class=yiv773644300apple-style-span><font size=3 color=black face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'>------</span></font></span><font
color=black face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><font size=3 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'>Best
Regadrs</span></font><font color=black face=Arial><span style='font-family:
Arial;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><font size=3 color=black
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black'>Eng.
Ayman Mohamed</span></font><font color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><font size=3 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</p>
</div>
</div>
<pre style='background:white'><fieldset class="yiv773644300mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>TRNSYS-users mailing list<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'><a href="mailto:TRNSYS-users@cae.wisc.edu"
target="_blank" ymailto="mailto:TRNSYS-users@cae.wisc.edu">TRNSYS-users@cae.wisc.edu</a><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'><a
href="https://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/listinfo/trnsys-users" target="_blank">https://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/listinfo/trnsys-users</a><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</pre>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'>
<font size=3 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</p>
<pre style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>***************************<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>David BRADLEY<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>Principal<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>Thermal Energy Systems Specialists, LLC<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>22 North Carroll Street - suite 370<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>Madison, WI 53703 USA<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>P:+1.608.274.2577<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>F:+1.608.278.1475<o:p></o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'><a href="mailto:d.bradley@tess-inc.com"
target="_blank" ymailto="mailto:d.bradley@tess-inc.com">d.bradley@tess-inc.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'><a href="http://www.tess-inc.com"
target="_blank">http://www.tess-inc.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</pre><pre
style='background:white'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'><a href="http://www.trnsys.com"
target="_blank">http://www.trnsys.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></font>
</pre></div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white'>
<font size=3
color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font>
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