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In Type56 a zone is defined as an volume of the building that can be
defined by a single temperature. When you define an "ideal" heating
type in TRNBuild, you are defining the zone temperature and you are
allowing the model to calculate the amount of energy required to
keep the zone at that temperature. Thus the placement of the heating
is irrelevant. It is idealized, it can provide as much or as little
energy as needed whenever it is needed in order to keep the zone at
the temperature you specify.<br>
Regards,<br>
David<br>
<br>
<br>
On 2/24/2011 08:48, � wrote:
<blockquote
cite="mid:AANLkTi==28Vym3ha4FonN3ULXPX2-sNAet+Zj9FDPKgi@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div>Dear all,</div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div>To ideal heating in TRNBUILD: Where is this heating? Can I
define its position? If so, how to define its position? How
is the ideal heating operating or working?</div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div>thanks !</div>
<div> </div>
<div>br.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>wy<br>
<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_quote">在 2011年2月24日 下午3:24， <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:trnsys-users-request@cae.wisc.edu">trnsys-users-request@cae.wisc.edu</a>></span>写
道：<br>
<blockquote style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);
margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"
class="gmail_quote">Send TRNSYS-users mailing list submissions
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more
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<br>
Today's Topics:<br>
<br>
1. Re: Problems with calling EES (Type66a) (Doms Joris)<br>
2. Re: RADIATIVE PART of Heating (??)<br>
<br>
<br>
---------- 已转发邮件 ----------<br>
From: Doms Joris <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:joris.doms@vito.be">joris.doms@vito.be</a>><br>
To: David BRADLEY <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:d.bradley@tess-inc.com">d.bradley@tess-inc.com</a>><br>
Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2011 15:17:49 +0100<br>
Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] Problems with calling EES
(Type66a)<br>
<div bgcolor="#ffffff">
<div><font color="#000000" face="Tahoma" size="2">David,</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="tahoma" size="2">Thank you for the reply.
The EES project was defenately openening and closing,
but EES itself stayed open. I fixed this problem now
with changing the pad for the EES project from</font></div>
<div><font face="tahoma" size="2">"c:\xxx\xxx\hydraulics\EES.ees"
to "\hydrolics\EES.ees".</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="tahoma" size="2">But now it seems that
EES-TRNSYS coupling has a limited number of outputs, is
this correct? When I run a long simulation with alot of
timesteps, the simulation stops after a while, I think
it is after 66000 timesteps with 20 inputs and 40
outputs with the EES-TRNSYS coupling. Is there a
solution for this?</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="tahoma" size="2">Using another type is no
option as I need to make calcultation with EES at every
timestep.</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="tahoma" size="2">Many thanks</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="tahoma" size="2">Joris Doms</font></div>
<div style="direction: ltr;">
<hr>
<font face="Tahoma" size="2"><b>Van:</b> David BRADLEY [<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:d.bradley@tess-inc.com" target="_blank">d.bradley@tess-inc.com</a>]<br>
<b>Verzonden:</b> dinsdag 22 februari 2011 23:40<br>
<b>Aan:</b> Doms Joris<br>
<b>CC:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu"
target="_blank">trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu</a><br>
<b>Onderwerp:</b> Re: [TRNSYS-users] Problems with
calling EES (Type66a)<br>
</font><br>
</div>
<div>Joris,<br>
It isn't actually the opening and closing that takes
time (EES stays running the whole time). The slowness is
the EES calculation time and the fact that EES is called
at every single timestep and at every single iteration
within a timestep of your TRNSYS simulation. There are a
few different versions of Type66 that allow you to avoid
calling EES whenever possible (basically an input that is
an on/off switch for the EES calculations). If you know
that your EES program doesn't have to be called (because
the device that it models is inactive) then you can "turn
off" the call to Type66 and save some time. Take a look at
the EES example in the ..\TrnsysXX\Examples\Calling_EES\
directory; all the different options are shown in there.<br>
Kind regards,<br>
David<br>
<br>
<br>
On 2/20/2011 15:43, Doms Joris wrote:
<blockquote>
<div>Dear TRNSYS users,</div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="times new roman">When simulating an
applied thermal system, I'm using EES for the
hydronic part. I programmed the hydronic circuit in
EES and coupled it with TRNSYS via Type 66a. This
coupling works fine, but;</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="times new roman">The problem is that
the simulation runs very slow. Every timestep that
TRNSYS calls EES, the EES project is opened and
closed. Is there a way to set some settings so EES
isen't closed and reopened each time, this would
minimize the solution time alot.</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="times new roman">Thanks on advance</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="times new roman">Joris Doms</font></div>
<br>
<hr>
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<pre><fieldset></fieldset>
_______________________________________________
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</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
<pre>--
***************************
David BRADLEY
Principal
Thermal Energy Systems Specialists, LLC
22 North Carroll Street - suite 370
Madison, WI 53703 USA
P:+1.608.274.2577
F:+1.608.278.1475
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:d.bradley@tess-inc.com" target="_blank">d.bradley@tess-inc.com</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.tess-inc.com/" target="_blank">http://www.tess-inc.com</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.trnsys.com/" target="_blank">http://www.trnsys.com</a></pre>
</div>
<p align="left"><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><font
color="#0000ff">
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<br>
---------- 已转发邮件 ----------<br>
From: 王洋 <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:wanghongyang1767@gmail.com">wanghongyang1767@gmail.com</a>><br>
To: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:duffy@tess-inc.com">duffy@tess-inc.com</a><br>
Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2011 15:24:08 +0100<br>
Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] RADIATIVE PART of Heating<br>
<div>Dear Mr. Duffy,</div>
<div> </div>
<div> Many thanks for your reply!</div>
<div> </div>
<div> I’m so sorry for sending multiple identical
emails to the TRNSYS users mailing list. Because I'm very
anxious not to get those answers, that's some tasks my
professor gave me, I must finish them these days. So I still
have no other way to do with them after asking other guys,
then I sent multiple identical emails to the TRNSYS users
mailing list.</div>
<div> </div>
<div> sorry again!</div>
<div> </div>
<div> Br.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>wang</div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div> <br>
<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_quote">2011/2/23 Matt Duffy <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:duffy@tess-inc.com"
target="_blank">duffy@tess-inc.com</a>></span><br>
<blockquote style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204,
204); margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"
class="gmail_quote"><br>
<br>
Dear Wang,<br>
<br>
<br>
The following document has information about
radiator/convector.<br>
<br>
<font size="3">
<p>ASHRAE, 2004 ASHRAE Handbook: HVAC Systems and
Equipment, ASHRAE, Atlanta</p>
</font>Perhaps a basic heat transfer text, such as
Incropera and Dewitt, may have information as well.<br>
<br>
Best regards,
<div>
<div><br>
<br>
Matt Duffy<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<div style="background-repeat: repeat-x;"><strong>-----
Original Message -----</strong><br>
<strong>From:</strong> "王洋" <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:wanghongyang1767@gmail.com"
target="_blank">wanghongyang1767@gmail.com</a>>
<br>
<strong>Sent:</strong> Wed, February 23, 2011 15:22<br>
<strong>Subject:</strong> [TRNSYS-users] RADIATIVE
PART of Heating<br>
<br>
<div>Dear all,<br>
<br>
I want to make sure the exact value about
RADIATIVE PART in the TRNBUILD Heating option.
e.g. What's the exact RADIATIVE PART or Convection
Part value of the wall heating and radiator and
convector?<br>
<br>
Or Please introduce me some TRNSYS references and
literature about RADIATIVE PART or Convection Part
value of the wall heating and radiator and
convector etc.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Please introduce me some best English books about
the heating(radiator, convector, Wandheizung and
floor heating) operating or working fundamentals
etc., walls' thermal energy storage and materials'
pyhsics property etc., the infiltration and
ventilation etc. and our this research topic's
literatures we must read.<br>
<br>
<br>
many thanks!<br>
<br>
Br.<br>
<br>
wang<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">在 2011年2月23日 上午11:01，王洋 <span
dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:wanghongyang1767@gmail.com"
target="_blank">wanghongyang1767@gmail.com</a>></span>写
道：<br>
<blockquote style="border-left: 1px solid
rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;
padding-left: 1ex;" class="gmail_quote">Dear
all,<br>
<br>
I want to make sure the exact value about
RADIATIVE PART in the TRNBUILD Heating option.
e.g. What's the exact RADIATIVE PART or
Convection Part value of the wall heating and
radiator and convector?<br>
<br>
Or Please introduce me some TRNSYS references
and literature about RADIATIVE PART or
Convection Part value of the wall heating and
radiator and convector etc.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Please introduce me some best English books
about the heating(radiator, convector,
Wandheizung and floor heating) operating or
working fundamentals etc., walls' thermal
energy storage and materials' pyhsics property
etc., the infiltration and ventilation etc.
and our this research topic's literatures we
must read.<br>
<br>
<br>
many thanks!<br>
<br>
Br.<br>
<br>
wang<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">2011/2/23 <span
dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:trnsys-users-request@cae.wisc.edu"
target="_blank">trnsys-users-request@cae.wisc.edu</a>></span><br>
<blockquote style="border-left: 1px solid
rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt
0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"
class="gmail_quote">Send TRNSYS-users
mailing list submissions to<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu"
target="_blank">trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu</a><br>
<br>
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World
Wide Web, visit<br>
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target="_blank">https://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/listinfo/trnsys-users</a><br>
or, via email, send a message with subject
or body 'help' to<br>
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You can reach the person managing the list
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target="_blank">trnsys-users-owner@cae.wisc.edu</a><br>
<br>
When replying, please edit your Subject
line so it is more specific<br>
than "Re: Contents of TRNSYS-users
digest..."<br>
<br>
Today's Topics:<br>
<br>
1. Re: Problems with calling EES
(Type66a) (David BRADLEY)<br>
2. Re: Type66 EES and TRNSYS (David
BRADLEY)<br>
3. Re: acceptable temperature range
(Fred Betz)<br>
<br>
<br>
---------- 已转发邮件 ----------<br>
From: David BRADLEY <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:d.bradley@tess-inc.com"
target="_blank">d.bradley@tess-inc.com</a>><br>
To: Doms Joris <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:joris.doms@vito.be"
target="_blank">joris.doms@vito.be</a>><br>
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2011 16:40:04 -0600<br>
Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] Problems with
calling EES (Type66a)<br>
<div bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">Joris,<br>
It isn't actually the opening and
closing that takes time (EES stays
running the whole time). The slowness is
the EES calculation time and the fact
that EES is called at every single
timestep and at every single iteration
within a timestep of your TRNSYS
simulation. There are a few different
versions of Type66 that allow you to
avoid calling EES whenever possible
(basically an input that is an on/off
switch for the EES calculations). If you
know that your EES program doesn't have
to be called (because the device that it
models is inactive) then you can "turn
off" the call to Type66 and save some
time. Take a look at the EES example in
the ..\TrnsysXX\Examples\Calling_EES\
directory; all the different options are
shown in there.<br>
Kind regards,<br>
David<br>
<br>
<br>
On 2/20/2011 15:43, Doms Joris wrote:
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>Dear TRNSYS users,</div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="times new roman">When
simulating an applied thermal
system, I'm using EES for the
hydronic part. I programmed the
hydronic circuit in EES and
coupled it with TRNSYS via Type
66a. This coupling works fine,
but;</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="times new roman">The
problem is that the simulation
runs very slow. Every timestep
that TRNSYS calls EES, the EES
project is opened and closed. Is
there a way to set some settings
so EES isen't closed and reopened
each time, this would minimize the
solution time alot.</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="times new roman">Thanks
on advance</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="times new roman">Joris
Doms</font></div>
<br>
<p align="left"><font face="Tahoma"
size="2"><font color="#0000ff">
<hr>
This e-mail, any attachments and
the information it contains are
confidential and meant only for
the use of the addressee(s)
only. Access to this e-mail by
anyone other than the
addressee(s) is unauthorized.
If you are not the intended
addressee (or responsible for
delivery of the message to such
person), you may not use, copy,
distribute or deliver to anyone
this message (or any part of its
contents) or take any action in
reliance on it. In such case,
you should destroy this message
and notify the sender
immediately. If you have
received this e-mail in error,
please notify us immediately by
e-mail or telephone and delete
the e-mail from any computer.<br>
All reasonable precautions have
been taken to ensure no viruses
are present in this e-mail and
its attachments. As our company
cannot accept responsibility for
any loss or damage arising from
the use of this e-mail or
attachments we recommend that
you subject these to your virus
checking procedures prior to
use.<br>
<hr>
</font></font>
</p>
<p> </p>
<pre><fieldset></fieldset>
_______________________________________________
TRNSYS-users mailing list
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</pre>
<p> </p>
</blockquote>
<br>
<pre cols="72">--
***************************
David BRADLEY
Principal
Thermal Energy Systems Specialists, LLC
22 North Carroll Street - suite 370
Madison, WI 53703 USA
P:+1.608.274.2577
F:+1.608.278.1475
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:d.bradley@tess-inc.com" target="_blank">d.bradley@tess-inc.com</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.tess-inc.com/" target="_blank">http://www.tess-inc.com</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.trnsys.com/" target="_blank">http://www.trnsys.com</a></pre>
</div>
<br>
<br>
---------- 已转发邮件 ----------<br>
From: David BRADLEY <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:d.bradley@tess-inc.com"
target="_blank">d.bradley@tess-inc.com</a>><br>
To: Simon Binnemans <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:simon.binnemans@khk.be"
target="_blank">simon.binnemans@khk.be</a>><br>
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2011 16:57:40 -0600<br>
Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] Type66 EES and
TRNSYS<br>
Simon,<br>
If you would be willing to send me your
TRNSYS project and EES code, I could
probably debug it and find out why
changing the size of szdelivertext isn't
solving it. It may be that there is a
limitation on the EES side of the
connection as well; please don't quote me
on that though until I get to look at it!<br>
Kind regards,<br>
David<br>
<br>
<br>
On 2/16/2011 04:36, Simon Binnemans wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="border-left: 1px solid
rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt
0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"
class="gmail_quote">Dear all,<br>
<br>
I am currently using the Type66 object
for exchanging data between TRNSYS and
ees.<br>
At first it worked very well, but when I
want to receive more than 34 inputs from
ees, TRNSYS alway generates an error:
"Error converting clipboard data to
numbers."<br>
After searching for this problem, I
found that the problem was situated in
the Type66 component, which only reads
the first 512 characters from the
clipboard. The suggested solution was to
modify the value of szdelivertext to a
higher number and recompile it.(<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/pipermail/trnsys-users/2009/004540.html"
target="_blank">https://mailman.cae.wisc.edu/pipermail/trnsys-users/2009/004540.html</a>)<br>
I modified the value of szdelivertext to
40 000 in stead of the standard 4000,
but the result stayed the same.<br>
<br>
Can anyone suggest a solution for this
problem?<br>
<br>
Best regards,<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
-- <br>
***************************<br>
David BRADLEY<br>
Principal<br>
Thermal Energy Systems Specialists, LLC<br>
22 North Carroll Street - suite 370<br>
Madison, WI 53703 USA<br>
<br>
P:+1.608.274.2577<br>
F:+1.608.278.1475<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:d.bradley@tess-inc.com"
target="_blank">d.bradley@tess-inc.com</a><br>
<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.tess-inc.com/"
target="_blank">http://www.tess-inc.com</a><br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.trnsys.com/"
target="_blank">http://www.trnsys.com</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
---------- 已转发邮件 ----------<br>
From: Fred Betz <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:fbetz@aeieng.com"
target="_blank">fbetz@aeieng.com</a>><br>
To: Shahrdad JavidRad <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:shahrdad@live.de"
target="_blank">shahrdad@live.de</a>>,
TRNSYS USERS <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu"
target="_blank">trnsys-users@cae.wisc.edu</a>><br>
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2011 17:42:26 -0600<br>
Subject: Re: [TRNSYS-users] acceptable
temperature range<br>
<div vlink="purple" link="blue"
lang="EN-US">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
font-size: 11pt;">You’ll probably
be better off using a simple
feedback controller rather than an
equation block because you can get
frequent starts and stops or
non-convergence warnings. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
font-size: 11pt;"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
font-size: 11pt;">Also, that’s a
pretty large temperature range to
operate over. Are you driving an
absorption chiller with those
temperatures? </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
font-size: 11pt;"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
font-size: 11pt;">You might be
better off controlling a variable
speed pump to maintain your
temperature range rather than
shutting the pump off when the
temperature exceeds 80C. If you
shut off the pump when the
temperature is over 80C, you risk
exceeding the stagnation
temperature of your panels in the
real world. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
font-size: 11pt;"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
font-size: 11pt;">There is a solar
thermal panel in the TESS
libraries that has a built in
controller that has an output for
a variable speed pump that works
really well. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
font-size: 11pt;"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
font-size: 11pt;">Good luck!</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
font-size: 11pt;"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
font-size: 11pt;">Fred</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
font-size: 11pt;"> </span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
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uppercase; color:
rgb(102, 0, 0);
font-size: 10pt;">Fred
Betz</span></b><b><span
style="color: rgb(51,
51, 51); font-size:
9pt;"> </span></b><span
style="color: rgb(51,
51, 51); font-size:
9pt;">PhD., LEED AP <br>
</span><span
style="text-transform:
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rgb(51, 51, 51);
font-size: 10pt;">Sustainable
Systems Analyst</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="color: rgb(102,
0, 0); font-size:
9pt;">AEI</span></b><span
style="color: rgb(51,
51, 51); font-size:
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ENGINEERS, INC. <br>
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| Madison, WI 53719<br>
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</span><span style="color:
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font-size: 9pt;">P:
608.236.1175 | F:
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style="color: rgb(51,
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
font-size: 11pt;"> </span></p>
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0in 0in;">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt;">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size: 10pt;">
Shahrdad JavidRad [mailto:<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:shahrdad@live.de"
target="_blank">shahrdad@live.de</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, February
22, 2011 12:11 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> TRNSYS USERS<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [TRNSYS-users]
acceptable temperature range</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 10pt;"><br>
Hello,<br>
<br>
in my solar thermal system </span><span><span
style="font-size: 10pt;"
lang="EN">I</span></span><span
style="font-size: 10pt;" lang="EN">
<span>want to</span> <span>define</span>
<span>an</span> <span>acceptable</span>
<span>interval</span> <span>for</span>
<span>the collector</span> <span>outlet</span>
<span>temperature</span> <span>[65-80°C]</span>
by giving an output signal=1 for
the pump in the collector loop.
For any other temperatures out of
this range </span><span
style="font-size: 10pt;">the
signal should be=0<br>
</span><span style="font-size:
10pt;" lang="EN"><br>
<span>For</span><span> </span><span>this</span><span>
</span><span>purpose I am using an
Equation block!! (Is there any
controller, that is able to do
it?)</span></span><span
style="font-size: 10pt;"><br>
<br>
I have defined these variables as:<br>
<br>
T_min=65<br>
T_max=80<br>
T_out= collector outlet
temperature<br>
<br>
Signal=AND(GT(T_out,T_min),LT(T_out,T_max))*1+(1-AND(GT(T_out,T_min),LT(T_out,T_max)))*0<br>
<br>
I have plotted the signal. It
works fine but I am experiencing a
very long simulation time. More
than 15 minutes just for a week.<br>
<br>
Is there any idea?<br>
<br>
Thanks,<br>
Shahrdad<br>
<br>
</span></p>
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<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
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David BRADLEY
Principal
Thermal Energy Systems Specialists, LLC
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P:+1.608.274.2577
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