<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:st1="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
<head>
<meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 11 (filtered medium)">
<!--[if !mso]>
<style>
v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
</style>
<![endif]--><o:SmartTagType
namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="City"/>
<o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"
name="place"/>
<o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"
name="PersonName"/>
<!--[if !mso]>
<style>
st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) }
</style>
<![endif]-->
<style>
<!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:Tahoma;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0cm;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Arial;}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{color:purple;
text-decoration:underline;}
p
{mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
margin-right:0cm;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
margin-left:0cm;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman";}
span.EmailStyle17
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:Arial;
color:windowtext;
font-weight:normal;
font-style:normal;
text-decoration:none none;}
span.EmailStyle20
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:Arial;
color:windowtext;
font-weight:normal;
font-style:normal;
text-decoration:none none;}
@page Section1
{size:595.3pt 841.9pt;
margin:70.85pt 70.85pt 70.85pt 70.85pt;}
div.Section1
{page:Section1;}
-->
</style>
</head>
<body lang=FR link=blue vlink=purple>
<div class=Section1>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Dear
Marion,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'>Thank you for your answer. I’m using TRNSYS 16, but have a
colleague who has a manual with another section numbering too. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'>Best regards,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;color:navy'>Charles LAUNAY</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>De :</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> hotline
[mailto:hotline@transsolar.com] <br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Envoyé :</span></b> jeudi 29 avril 2010
12:07<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>À :</span></b> LAUNAY Charles 226591;
trnsys-users<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Objet :</span></b> AW: [TRNSYS-users]
Long wave radiation in the energy balance (Type 56)</span></font><font
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;color:blue'>Dear Charles Luanay,</span></font><font
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-family:"Times New Roman"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;color:blue'>thanks for pointing this out! </span></font><font
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;color:blue'>I check the coding of this section, and the manual has a
sign error and the drawing is wrong too:</span></font><font
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-family:"Times New Roman"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'> </span></font><font size=2
color=blue><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;color:blue'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:blue'>Instead of <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:blue'>q_comb,s,o = q_c,s,o + q_r,s,o</span></font><span
lang=EN-GB> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:blue'>it should be</span></font><span lang=EN-GB>
</span><font size=2 color=blue><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;
color:blue'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:blue'>q_comb,s,o = q_c,s,o - q_r,s,o</span></font><span
lang=EN-GB> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:blue'>q_r,s,o is defined as a loss :</span></font><span
lang=EN-GB> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:blue'>q_r,s,o = sigma * epsilon_s,o * (T_s,o^4
– T_fsky^4)</span></font><span lang=EN-GB> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:blue'>Cheers,</span></font><span lang=EN-GB> </span><font
size=2 color=blue><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;color:blue'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
</span></font><font size=2 color=blue><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;
color:blue'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on"><font size=2
color=blue face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt;color:blue'>Marion</span></font></st1:place></st1:City><span
lang=EN-GB> </span><font size=2 color=blue><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt;color:blue'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=blue face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;color:blue'>P.S.: What version of TRNSYS are you using? The section
numbering of the Type 56 user’s manual looks somwhat strange to me.</span></font><font
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-family:"Times New Roman"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span lang=DE style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabIndex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span lang=DE style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'>
</span></font><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=DE style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>Von:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span lang=DE style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> LAUNAY
Charles 226591 [mailto:charles.launay@cea.fr] <br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Gesendet:</span></b> Donnerstag, 29. April
2010 10:25<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>An:</span></b> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">trnsys-users@engr.wisc.edu</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Betreff:</span></b> [TRNSYS-users] Long wave
radiation in the energy balance (Type 56)</span></font><font
face="Times New Roman"><span lang=DE style='font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Dear
users, <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'>I have a question concerning section 2.1.7. of the Type 56 user’s
manual : “2. General Mathematical Description of the Thermal Model”
> “2.1.7. The Long-wave radiation”.</span></font><span
lang=EN-GB> </span><font size=2><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'>My question is concerning the formulation of the net radiative heat
transfer with surfaces in view of the outside surface, q_r,s,o. We can read :</span></font><span
lang=EN-GB> </span><font size=2><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'>q_r,s,o = sigma * epsilon_s,o * (T_s,o^4 – T_fsky^4)</span></font><span
lang=EN-GB> </span><font size=2><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'>that I understand as the net losses of the outside surface by long wave
radiation. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'>However, q_r,s,o is counted as a gain in the energy balance (with a
plus sign) : <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'>q_s,o = q_comb,s,o + S_s,o</span></font><span lang=EN-GB> </span><font
size=2><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'>with q_comb,s,o = q_c,s,o + q_r,s,o</span></font><span lang=EN-GB> </span><font
size=2><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'>(see figure 3 “Surface heat flux and temperature”, section
2,1,5. for the nomenclature)</span></font><span lang=EN-GB> </span><font
size=2><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'>How does it happen? How is the heat transfer by long wave radiation
really taken into account in Type 56? <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'>Thanks for your help.</span></font><span lang=EN-GB> </span><font
size=2><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'>Kind regards, <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy'>Charles LAUNAY</span></font><span
lang=EN-GB> </span><span lang=EN-GB><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face=Arial><span lang=EN-GB style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span><span lang=EN-GB> </span></font><span lang=EN-GB><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><strong><b><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy;font-weight:normal'>CEA
INES</span></font></b></strong> <strong><b><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy;font-weight:normal'><o:p></o:p></span></font></b></strong></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=3 face=Arial><span style='font-size:12.0pt;
font-weight:bold'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></b></p>
</div>
</body>
</html>