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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">If the energy (kWh) of the pump divided by the peak demand (kW) is something close to 8760, this indicates not only that the pump is running 24/7, but that the pump power does
not vary. Some baseline loops are required to have VSD pumps. But even single-speed pumps are required to be “variable flow” by “riding the pump curve”. To model this, you have to use two-way valves. Alex Chapin mentioned this in his reply below. When you
make the changes Alex describes below (and one more – remove the process load on the secondary chilled water loop), the EFLH drops down to around 6,000 hours for all three loops.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">~Bill<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Medium",sans-serif;color:black">William Bishop, PE, BEMP, BEAP, CEM, LEED AP<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Senior Energy Engineer<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
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(585) 698-1956</span></i></b><b><i><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#002060">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><a href="mailto:wbishop@pathfinder-ea.com"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:blue">bbishop@pathfinder-ea.com</span></a></span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><a href="http://www.pathfinder-ea.com/"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:blue">www.pathfinder-ea.com</span></a></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">134 South Fitzhugh Street<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Rochester, NY 14608
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</span><i><span style="font-size:7.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#00B0F0">Ask me why Carbon Fee & Dividend may be right for you.</span></i><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Equest-users <equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Nicholas Caton via Equest-users<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, January 25, 2019 1:51 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Chapin, Alex N <Alex.Chapin@masonandhanger.com>; Morteza Kasmai <morteza.kasmai@gmail.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] High pumps equivalent full load hours in the model<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Not to make this more difficult than necessary, but could I take a step back and ask: Can anyone comment regarding what exactly between LEED and/or 90.1 precludes 24/7 hydronic
loop circulation?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">This is NOT an uncommon control scheme to encounter in the real world, and the inherent simplicity of 24/7, constant-speed operations carry some real advantages with respect
to system first-cost, simplicity / troubleshooting, and maintenance over time. <o:p>
</o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">That’s not to say variable flow pumps, demand based on/off controls, and other schemes are a bad idea (I’m regularly implementing such strategies where it pencils out), but
I’ve encountered a number of cases where variable-flow upgrades implemented badly can end up causing more harm ($$$/downtime) than good.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">I am left sincerely interested to learn and understand what exactly the LEED reviewers may be expecting/requiring of hydronic system pumping operations.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">~Nick<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#3A7A46"><img border="0" width="726" height="9" style="width:7.5625in;height:.0937in" id="Picture_x0020_1" src="cid:image008.png@01D4B4BB.754D9610" alt="cid:image001.png@01D4B19C.3EADA950"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#3A7A46">Nick Caton, P.E., BEMP</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#3A7A46"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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</span><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#626469"> Regional Energy Engineering Manager<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#626469"> Energy and Sustainability Services</span><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#57B069">D </span><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#626469">913.564.6361
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</span><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#57B069">M </span><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#626469">785.410.3317
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</span><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#57B069">E </span><a href="mailto:nicholas.caton@schneider-electric.com"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#626469">nicholas.caton@schneider-electric.com</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" align="right" style="text-align:right"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#626469">15200 Santa Fe Trail Drive<br>
Suite 204<br>
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United States</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Equest-users <<a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Chapin, Alex N via Equest-users<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, January 21, 2019 7:14 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Morteza Kasmai <<a href="mailto:morteza.kasmai@gmail.com">morteza.kasmai@gmail.com</a>>;
<a href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] High pumps equivalent full load hours in the model<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p><span style="color:red">[External email: Use caution with links and attachments]</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Hi Morteza,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">I looked at the file quickly and it seems that there are some changes that you can make to reduce the EFLHs slightly (I was able to get it to 8,146 hours/year
by changing to two-way HW and CHW coils, moving cooling coils to secondary loop, readjusting pump flows and power after other changes, and setting loop operation to demand), but it seems like the underlying cause of the high EFLHs is probably due to having
VAV systems which only serve interior spaces which are probably going to be in cooling mode year round.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Note that I think you can model the corridors on floors with residential as PTACs also. I believe that the reviewer should allow you to be flexible in how you
define the corridor off of residential spaces. This might help reduce the pump EFLHs for primary and secondary chilled water pumps, assuming those VAVs which only serve core spaces are part of what is driving the high EFLHs.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Alex Chapin</span></b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black"> EIT, BEMP, LEED AP BD+C, O+M
<br>
Energy Engineer </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#BA0C2F">|
</span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Mason & Hanger
<br>
A Day & Zimmermann Company <br>
<b>D </b>804.521.7072 </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#BA0C2F">|
</span><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">O
</span></b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">804.285.4171
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</span></b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">804.217.8520
<br>
4880 Sadler Road, Suite 300 </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#BA0C2F">|
</span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Glen Allen, VA 23060
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</span><b><i><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Adobe Garamond";color:#BA0C2F">Building a More Secure World</span></i></b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Morteza Kasmai <</span><a href="mailto:morteza.kasmai@gmail.com"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">morteza.kasmai@gmail.com</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">>
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<b>Sent:</b> Friday, January 18, 2019 1:29 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> </span><a href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Equest-users] High pumps equivalent full load hours in the model<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#274E13">Hello all,</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#274E13"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#274E13">I received following LEED review comment:</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#274E13"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#274E13"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#274E13"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:DejaVuSans;color:#444444">“The Baseline model pumps equivalent full load hours (determined by dividing the total annual pumps consumption (45,761 KWH) by the pump peak demand (5.426 KW) reflected
in the simulation output report) is 8,433 hours/year, which is unexpectedly high given the anticipated schedule of operation for the project.”</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#274E13"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#274E13"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#274E13"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#274E13">This is a 9 story residential building with unfinished retail space in the ground floor. Primary HVAC system in the baseline case is PTAC and the secondary system that serves non-residential
spaces is System 7 – VAV with reheat and chilled water. HVAC system in unfinished retail space of the propose model is System 7 as well. Pumps equivalent full load hours for the proposed model is 8,089 hours/year (15,401/1.905), which is close to EFLH of the
baseline case. </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#274E13"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#274E13"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#274E13"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#274E13">Is this high EFLH loads relate to the primary and secondary pumps in both of the models and are justifiable or there is something wrong with the models. Attached are inp and pd2 files
of the baseline model from version 3.65 build 7173.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#274E13"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#274E13">Thank you for your help,</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#274E13"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p style="margin-bottom:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#006600;letter-spacing:.15pt">Morteza Kasmaei<br>
Senior Architect</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#006600">LEED AP BD+C, GGP</span><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#006600"> </span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
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