<div dir="ltr">Hi Bruce,<div><br></div><div>I've attached the sketches of this building. As you see, the northeast portion is higher than the rest, But actually they are in the same zone. I had two shells attached to each other and deleted the overlapping walls. So you think I should make is in one shell, and just set the plenum in different heights?</div><div>Thank you so much for your time and effort.</div><div><br></div><div>Jing</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Nov 9, 2017 at 12:41 PM, Bruce Easterbrook <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:bruce5@bellnet.ca" target="_blank">bruce5@bellnet.ca</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
You shouldn't have overlapping walls. There should be a wall
between the 2 zones that is common and in 2 areas if you used the
plenum setup to deal with the height differences. It will be an
interior wall initially but can be changed to exterior if you delete
exterior walls in the second zone. You will also need to make the
ceiling below a roof which means what you need to reflect the zones
in the floor above and the floor below. I assume you are dealing
with a portion of the floor with the different foot prints from a
week or so ago.<br>
Normally I don't use the 2 shell method but sometimes it was the
only way forward and have. It seemed to me you wouldn't have to do
that in this case. Having the 2 zones allows you to have them at
the same conditions or different. By adding in the plenum spaces
gives you 4 zones. What you are doing is trying to is mimic the
constructions and boundary conditions. By that I meant is the
surface adjacent to another zone or to the exterior. That is the
only condition you need to worry about at this time.<br>
A few things are coming back but it has been a while since I have
done this. To eQuest a wall is just a line, typically taken as the
centre line of the wall. It has no thickness. This can trip you up
if you are using 2 shells. They have to occupy the same space
before you delete one. I know I had to play with the wireframe to
make sure I was deleting the right wall. I also remember sometimes
having to adjust the polygons as they have a direction. That may
present itself when changing an interior wall to exterior.<br>
In short I'm not exactly sure what you are trying to do. A picture
or sketch might help. Some of these work arounds are tricky and my
time is short. I'm working from memory to sketch the concept for
you. So there might be a few details that have escaped me.<span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><br>
Bruce</font></span><span class=""><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="m_-7518544207277625671moz-cite-prefix">On 11/9/2017 11:47 AM, Jing Hong wrote:<br>
</div>
</span><blockquote type="cite"><span class="">
<div dir="ltr">Hi Bruce,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Thanks for your patient explanation. Yes, I did split a
room into two zones (and also two shells). And then deleted
the overlapping exterior walls, which should not exist. When
you said "<span style="font-size:12.8px">reflect what is
actually happening at the boundary</span>". Does that mean
you make the adjacent two zones the same condition and work as
one zone? Could you please clarify how to set that up? I
really appreciate. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Jing</div>
</div>
</span><div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote"><span class="">On Thu, Nov 9, 2017 at 9:21 AM, Bruce
Easterbrook <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:bruce5@bellnet.ca" target="_blank">bruce5@bellnet.ca</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
</span><div><div class="h5"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF"> Hi Jing,<br>
It is a little difficult to tell from your explanation of
what you are doing but it doesn't seem like the correct
approach to me. eQuest will allow you to have different
zones for the conductive/thermal model and then different
zone configurations for the HVAC model. Differing
constructions I do as separate zones. It makes putting
all the boxes together. All surfaces have to be accounted
for. Everything has to conduct to another zone or to the
exterior. Even if you miss a 1" strip the model will
throw errors. When you build your model I find it better
to err on the side of too many zones. Your picks of areas
for zones need to initially reflect how the building is
constructed but also thinking of how the building is going
to be heated and cooled.<br>
I would split that zone you are working on into 2. Each
portion will cover the different ceiling height. Give
each zone a plenum and make it the height of the
difference in the zone heights. That will allow you to
split the wall into 2 different sections and give each one
different properties. It also gives you 2 ceilings. Make
the one with the higher ceiling an air wall type
boundary. Adjust the plenum wall construction to reflect
what is actually happening at the boundary. Adjust the
ceiling construction of the room/plenum of the lower zone,
delete what you don't need. Later when doing the HVAC you
can put both of these zones on the same unit. So you
don't necessarily zone a building according to the
proposed HVAC system. You have to take the
discontinuities into account and add zones to make it
easier to model. Every thermal box has to be perfectly
closed or eQuest will stall on you. You are lucky it
tossed warning messages, these are clues to what you have
missed. You are close. It is really bad when you crash
and don't get clues.<br>
Good luck. You seem to be coming along fine. One other
tip, stay in the detailed wizard as long as possible.
Ignore windows and just leave them as general areas until
you get everything else worked out. Save files lots so
you can go back if something happens. They are like
restore points. The closer you are to the crash the less
work you lose. Plus, projects change once everyone starts
looking at the modelling results, you find more efficient
ways and need to be able to adjust your model.<br>
Bruce Easterbrook P.Eng.<br>
Abode Engineering
<div>
<div class="m_-7518544207277625671h5"><br>
<br>
<div class="m_-7518544207277625671m_7637244212381738145moz-cite-prefix">On
11/9/2017 9:17 AM, Jing Hong via Equest-users wrote:<br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div class="m_-7518544207277625671h5">
<div dir="ltr">Dear All,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I built up two shells for a room with two
different ceiling heights. And then deleted the
exterior walls. Now the BDL Load File Log shows
some warnings of no delayed wall, no delay
ceiling for those spaces. Should I ignore those
warnings? Or try to fix them? Am I doing
correctly to deal with a zone with different
heights in this way?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Thanks,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Jing<br clear="all">
<div><br>
</div>
-- <br>
<div class="m_-7518544207277625671m_7637244212381738145gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>PhD Candidate, LEED AP BD+C</div>
<div><span style="font-size:12.8px"><br>
</span></div>
<div><span style="font-size:12.8px">School
of Architecture and Urban Planning</span></div>
<div>University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
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<div><br>
</div>
-- <br>
<div class="m_-7518544207277625671gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>PhD Candidate, LEED AP BD+C</div>
<div><span style="font-size:12.8px"><br>
</span></div>
<div><span style="font-size:12.8px">School of
Architecture and Urban Planning</span></div>
<div>University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div></div></div>
</blockquote>
<br>
</div>
</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div>PhD Candidate, LEED AP BD+C</div><div><span style="font-size:12.8px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8px">School of Architecture and Urban Planning</span></div><div>University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee</div><div><br></div></div></div></div></div></div>
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