<div dir="ltr">Hi everyone - thank you so much for the replies. Just wanted to provide as a summary as to what I've modeled thus far - pls comment if you have any:<div><br></div><div><u>SYSTEM LEVEL:</u></div><div><u><br></u></div><div>- Modeled the reverse acting t-stat system as a PSZ with the following inputs at the system level:</div><div>- Control zone is the zone the supply fan serves</div><div>- Supply fan kW/CFM equals that of the EF</div><div>- Delta T across supply fan = 0</div><div>- Supply fan schedule is on/off type with default off for all hours</div><div>- Night Cycle Control: On Any</div><div>- min outside air ratio = 1.0</div><div>- CLG Cap left blank</div><div>- EIR = 0<br></div><div><br></div><div><u>ZONE LEVEL:</u></div><div><u><br></u></div><div>- HTG/CLG design temps are 60/80 degF;</div><div>- E/A control is "No Airflow Tracking"</div><div>- E/A flow matching the flow of the EF (11,000 CFM)</div><div>- E/A source: infiltration</div><div>- Max clg rate left blank</div><div><br></div><div><u>QUESTIONS REMAINING:</u></div><div><br></div><div>- Can I simply leave the CLG capacity to be auto-sized? Brian you had mentioned to put in a minimal value for this input but I do not understand why.</div><div>- This zone also has HW UHs serving it - how to I implement them? I see at the system level there's an option for the Zone Heat Source to be furnace which provides the opportunity to account for a UH's fan energy but looks like a furnace cannot be connected to a HW loop. </div><div> - Any advice of thermostat type?</div><div><br></div><div>Thanks again</div><div>Darryl Kasun</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 11:04 AM, Nicholas Caton <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:Nicholas.Caton@schneider-electric.com" target="_blank">Nicholas.Caton@schneider-electric.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
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<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Hey Brian,<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">You’re absolutely right – I should have double-checked before posting. In my mind’s eye, I recalled assigning a temperature schedule to zonal exhaust inputs, but it does appear I misremembered and that isn’t a direct option.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Tricking an airside system as you’re describing into the intended behavior must be how I’ve managed this in the past. A thermostat schedule is minimally needed at the system to define the intended “trigger temperatures,” and one could
optionally also specify a fan schedule to go beyond intermittent and enforce off/on hours as might happen in the real world via tstat + relays.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">~Nick<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#3a7a46">Nick Caton, P.E., BEMP</span></b><span style="color:#3a7a46"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" align="right" style="text-align:right"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#626469">15200 Santa Fe Trail Drive<br>
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<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">-----Original Message-----<br>
From: Brian Fountain [mailto:<a href="mailto:bfountain@greensim.com" target="_blank">bfountain@greensim.com</a><wbr>] <br>
Sent: Monday, October 17, 2016 9:55 AM<br>
To: Nicholas Caton <<a href="mailto:Nicholas.Caton@schneider-electric.com" target="_blank">Nicholas.Caton@schneider-<wbr>electric.com</a>>; Julien MARREC <<a href="mailto:julien.marrec@gmail.com" target="_blank">julien.marrec@gmail.com</a>>; Darryl Kasun <<a href="mailto:darryl.kasun@gmail.com" target="_blank">darryl.kasun@gmail.com</a>><br>
Cc: equest-users <<a href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users@lists.<wbr>onebuilding.org</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Modeling Reverse Acting TStat EF<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Does this mean the exhaust fan can cycle based on zone temperature? I had thought that the exhaust fan schedule was just on/off, on/off/flag and fraction. That means you have to pre-define the expected schedule rather than having the
EF respond to the hourly space timestep temperature. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">What we have done in the past is to model the EF as a PSZ with the fan power as the supply fan power and the "indoor fan mode" as intermittent. Cooling capacity set to a small non-zero value (as zero invokes auto-sizing). <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"> Original Message <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">From: Nicholas Caton via Equest-users<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Sent: Monday, October 17, 2016 10:39 AM<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">To: Julien MARREC; Darryl Kasun<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Reply To: Nicholas Caton<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Cc: equest-users<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Modeling Reverse Acting TStat EF<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">From: Nicholas Caton<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Sent: Monday, October 17, 2016 9:38 AM<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">To: 'Julien MARREC' <<a href="mailto:julien.marrec@gmail.com" target="_blank"><span style="color:windowtext;text-decoration:none">julien.marrec@gmail.com</span></a>>; Darryl Kasun <<a href="mailto:darryl.kasun@gmail.com" target="_blank"><span style="color:windowtext;text-decoration:none">darryl.kasun@gmail.com</span></a>><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Subject: RE: [Equest-users] Modeling Reverse Acting TStat EF<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Yep - Julien has the right idea!<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">The other input of interest for your case is that at the same input screen, you can select the exhaust source as "infiltration," which means the associated makeup airstream = outside conditions.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">~Nick<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Nick Caton, P.E., BEMP<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Senior Energy Engineer<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Energy and Sustainability Services<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Schneider Electric<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">D <a href="tel:913.564.6361" value="+19135646361" target="_blank">913.564.6361</a><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">M <a href="tel:785.410.3317" value="+17854103317" target="_blank">785.410.3317</a><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">E <a href="mailto:nicholas.caton@schneider-electric.com" target="_blank">
<span style="color:windowtext;text-decoration:none">nicholas.caton@schneider-<wbr>electric.com</span></a><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">F <a href="tel:913.564.6380" value="+19135646380" target="_blank">913.564.6380</a><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">15200 Santa Fe Trail Drive<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Suite 204<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Lenexa, KS 66219<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">United States<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">-----Original Message-----<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">From: Equest-users [<a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank"><span style="color:windowtext;text-decoration:none">mailto:equest-users-bounces@<wbr>lists.onebuilding.org</span></a>] On Behalf Of Julien MARREC via Equest-users<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Sent: Saturday, October 15, 2016 3:41 PM<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">To: Darryl Kasun <<a href="mailto:darryl.kasun@gmail.com" target="_blank"><span style="color:windowtext;text-decoration:none">darryl.kasun@gmail.com</span></a>><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Cc: equest <<a href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank"><span style="color:windowtext;text-decoration:none">equest-users@lists.<wbr>onebuilding.org</span></a>><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Modeling Reverse Acting TStat EF<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Zonal exhaust fan has an option to control that on a temp schedule if I recall correctly.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Open the zone, tab "outside air" then at the right you can specify a zonal exhaust fan. (All this from memory so might differ slightly)<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Cheers,<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Julien<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">Envoyé de mon iPhone<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">> Le 15 oct. 2016 à 20:57, Darryl Kasun via Equest-users <<a href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank"><span style="color:windowtext;text-decoration:none">equest-users@lists.<wbr>onebuilding.org</span></a>> a écrit :<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">> Hi eQUESTers,<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">> First off, you probably will not likely appreciate this and I'll preface this with saying that I'm a total bandwagon jumper but I am okay with that.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">> GO JAYS!!!<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">> Now that that's out of the way I am trying to model a very simple system that I'm sure many of you have modeled before.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">> I have a zone that has an exhaust fan in it. When the temp. reaches above 80 degF, an exhaust fan turns on and a damper opens to draw OA into the zone.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">> I've been fooling around with a few systems trying to figure out a good way to model this but haven't come up with one yet.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">> Let me know if have any recommendations.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">> Thanks!<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">> Darryl<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_6847876830156294957MsoPlainText">><u></u> <u></u></p>
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