<div dir="ltr">Sorry for any confusion, I was just copying/pasting my LEED response for a system Type 5. Yes, you would follow G3.1.2.9 with the appropriate numbers for system types 3-4.  <div><br></div><div>LEED refers you to the EMIT user guide for these formulas, you can reference that:</div><div><a href="http://www.rmi.org/Content/Files/EMITUsersGuide.pdf">http://www.rmi.org/Content/Files/EMITUsersGuide.pdf</a><br></div><div><br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all"><div><div class="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><b>Elizabeth Gillmor  <font size="1">PE, LC, LEED AP</font></b><div><br></div><div><span style="font-size:large;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"><b><font color="#38761d" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">e n e r g e t i c s  </font></b></span><b><font color="#38761d" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">consulting engineers, llc</font></b></div><div><font size="2" style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255)" color="#666666"><a href="http://energetics-eng.com" target="_blank">energetics-eng.com</a></font></div><div><span style="font-size:small;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"><font color="#666666">c 303.619.0091</font></span><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at 6:23 AM, Omar ElRawy <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:omaroelrawy@gmail.com" target="_blank">omaroelrawy@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Dear all,</font><div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">             Thanks <span style="color:black">William Bishop, </span>Elizabeth Gillmor, Yongqingzhao, and <span style="white-space:nowrap">Maria Karpman, this is a lot of helpful data.</span></font></div><div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><span style="white-space:nowrap"><br></span></font></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">I think <b>Maria</b> did brief the whole subject, but I just need to ask few questions that will help in well documenting this point to the LEED reviewer:</span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"><b>1. Where can I find these official formulas so that I can refer to and attach to my reply please? </b></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"><b>2. What is the difference between SEER and SEER2, and HSPF and HSPF2?</b></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"><br></span></div><div><br></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"><b><u>Concerning fan power</u></b>, I'am referring to ASHRAE 90.1 2007 section 3.1.2.9<u> to find the following:</u></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"><u><br></u></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">bhp = CFMs x 0.00094 + A       ----- (where I'am considering my auto-sized eQuest CFM for this value)</span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">Pfan (Watts) = bhp × 746 / Fan Motor Efficiency    (For systems 3 through 8)</span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">So I'am stopping at both equations to find myself confused with <b>Elizabeth</b>'s equations (KW/cfm = bhp/0.746*Fan Motor Efficiency, and  bhp=CFM x 0.0013+A)</span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">For example, my system is 248 CFM, as per </span><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">section 3.1.2.9, my calculations will be as follows</span><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">:</span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px"><br></span></div><div><ul><li><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">bhp=248x0.00094+0 = 0.23312</span><br></li><li><span style="font-size:12.8000001907349px">Pfan = (0.23312x746)/0.825 = 210.79 W</span><br></li><li>W/CFM = 210.79/248 = 0.8499 W/CFM<br></li></ul></div><div><br></div><div><b>I wonder if Elizabeth is using a different 90.1 version, or I'am just confused at the 3.1.2.9 interpretation?</b></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Thanks for consideration,</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all"><div><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><blockquote style="padding:0px;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;font-size:16px;border:none;margin-top:0px!important;margin-bottom:0px!important"><b style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8000001907349px">Omar ElRawy, LEED AP BD+C</b><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8000001907349px">LEED Project Manager</div><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8000001907349px">EA Sustainable Building Consultants</div><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8000001907349px"><a href="http://www.ea-buildingconsultants.com/" target="_blank">http://www.ea-buildingconsultants.com</a></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div></div>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 4:10 PM, Maria Karpman <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:maria.karpman@karpmanconsulting.net" target="_blank">maria.karpman@karpmanconsulting.net</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Note that 90.1 2013 finally supplied the “official” formulas for extracting fan power from EER, SEER, COP47, and HSPF ratings. The resulting EIR is slighting different compared to the eQUEST formulas discussed below that many of us have been using – for example, the ASHRAE equations account for system capacity, resulting in varying EIR depending on system size.  <u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">For Baseline HVAC Systems 1,<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">2, 3, 4, 5, and 6, calculate the minimum COP</span><i><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPS-ItalicMT","serif"">nfcooling </span></i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">and<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">COP</span><i><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPS-ItalicMT","serif"">nfheating </span></i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">using the equation for the applicable performance<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">rating as indicated in Tables 6.8.1-1 through 6.8.1-4.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">Where a full- and part-load efficiency rating is provided in<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">Tables 6.8.1-1 through 6.8.1-4, the full-load equation below<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">shall be used:<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif""><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">COP</span><i><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPS-ItalicMT","serif"">nfcooling </span></i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">= 7.84E-8 × EER × </span><i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPS-ItalicMT","serif"">Q </span></i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">+ 0.338 × EER<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">COP</span><i><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPS-ItalicMT","serif"">nfcooling </span></i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">= –0.0076 × SEER</span><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">2 </span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">+ 0.3796 × SEER<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">COP</span><i><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPS-ItalicMT","serif"">nfheating </span></i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">= 1.48E-7 × COP</span><i><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPS-ItalicMT","serif"">47 </span></i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">× </span><i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPS-ItalicMT","serif"">Q </span></i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">+ 1.062 × COP</span><i><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPS-ItalicMT","serif"">47<u></u><u></u></span></i></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">(applies to heat-pump heating efficiency only)<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">COP</span><i><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPS-ItalicMT","serif"">nfheating </span></i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">= –0.0296 × HSPF</span><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">2 </span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">+ 0.7134 × HSPF<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif""><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">where COP</span><i><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPS-ItalicMT","serif"">nfcooling </span></i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">and COP</span><i><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPS-ItalicMT","serif"">nfheating </span></i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">are the packaged HVAC<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">equipment cooling and heating energy efficiency, respectively,<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">to be used in the baseline building, which excludes<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">supply fan power, and </span><i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPS-ItalicMT","serif"">Q </span></i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">is the AHRI-rated cooling capacity<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">in Btu/h.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">EER, SEER, COP, and HSPF shall be at AHRI test conditions.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">Fan energy shall be modeled separately according to<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"TimesNewRomanPSMT","serif"">Section G3.1.2.10.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> <u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">-- <u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#666666">Maria Karpman </span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#666666">LEED AP, BEMP, CEM</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#666666">________________</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#666666">Karpman Consulting<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#666666"><a href="http://www.karpmanconsulting.net/" target="_blank"><span style="color:blue">www.karpmanconsulting.net</span></a> </span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#666666">Phone </span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#666666;background:white"><a href="tel:860.430.1909" value="+18604301909" target="_blank">860.430.1909</a> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#666666">41C New London Turnpike</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#666666">Glastonbury, CT 06033</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Equest-users [mailto:<a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Elizabeth Gillmor<br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, June 09, 2015 11:32 AM<br><b>To:</b> Jones, Christopher</span></p><div><div><br><b>Cc:</b> equest<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] Indoor fan separation at ARI<u></u><u></u></div></div><p></p><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal">Chris you are right, the unit labels should have been W/cfm not kW.  Thanks for the catch!  <u></u><u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><img border="0" width="523" height="64" src="cid:image005.png@01D0A365.BA646370" alt="Inline image 2"><u></u><u></u></p></div></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><br clear="all"><u></u><u></u></p><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><b>Elizabeth Gillmor  </b><b><span style="font-size:7.5pt">PE, LC, LEED AP</span></b><u></u><u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#38761d;background:white">e n e r g e t i c s  </span></b><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#38761d">consulting engineers, llc</span></b><u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#666666;background:white"><a href="http://energetics-eng.com" target="_blank">energetics-eng.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#666666;background:white">c <a href="tel:303.619.0091" value="+13036190091" target="_blank">303.619.0091</a></span><u></u><u></u></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 8:49 AM, Jones, Christopher <<a href="mailto:Christopher.r.Jones@wspgroup.com" target="_blank">Christopher.r.Jones@wspgroup.com</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Just checking but 0.365 kW/cfm seems pretty high.  That is 356 W/cfm.  The DOE2.2 default is 0.0006 kW/cfm, 0.6 W/cfm for the PSZ system</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><img border="0" width="108" height="43" src="cid:image006.png@01D0A365.BA646370" alt="cid:image003.png@01D09C46.E75BA0D0"></span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1c467a">Christopher Jones,</span></b><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">P.Eng.<i> <br></i></span><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Senior Engineer</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></b><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">WSP Canada Inc.</span></b><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">2300 Yonge Street, Suite 2300</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Toronto, ON M4P 1E4</span><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#595959"><br></span><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">T <a href="tel:%2B1%20416-644-4226" target="_blank">+1 416-644-4226</a></span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">F <a href="tel:%2B1%20416-487-9766" target="_blank">+1 416-487-9766</a></span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">C <a href="tel:%2B1%20416-697-0065" target="_blank">+1 416-697-0065</a></span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><a href="http://www.wspgroup.com/" target="_blank">www.wspgroup.com</a> </span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Equest-users [mailto:<a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Elizabeth Gillmor<br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, June 09, 2015 10:09 AM<br><b>To:</b> Omar ElRawy<br><b>Cc:</b> equest<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] Indoor fan separation at ARI</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal">I seem to get this comment frequently so I have it all typed out as a stock LEED comment response.  The advice you received is correct. You can use the following formulas for fan power and EIR:<u></u><u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">kW/cfm = BHP / 0.746 * Fan Motor Efficiency     (<----from Appendix G)</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""> </span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">BHP = CFM * 0.0013 + Pressure Drop Adjustment</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">The baseline EIR is then calculated with fan energy modeled separately, using the following formula (same as what eQuest uses in Wizard mode):</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><img border="0" width="310" height="49" src="cid:image007.png@01D0A365.BA646370" alt="Inline image 1"></span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">Where ARI Fan Power = fan power at rated ARI conditions (W/Btuh), and CAP = total cooling capacity (Btuh).  At rated ARI conditions, the supply fan is rated at 0.365 kW/cfm and 400 cfm/ton, such that:</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><img border="0" width="465" height="62" src="cid:image008.png@01D0A365.BA646370" alt="Inline image 2"></span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">When normalizing the cooling capacity, the formula is:</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><img border="0" width="501" height="77" src="cid:image009.png@01D0A365.BA646370" alt="Inline image 3"></span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">When applied to a baseline EER=9.5, the resulting EIR=0.3051.  The eQuest wizard will also do this for you correctly, but usually at LEED submittal time we are all well past the wizard phase, so the formulas above are handy to have.  </span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">Good luck!</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">Elizabeth</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center"> <u></u><u></u></p></div></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><br clear="all"><u></u><u></u></p><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><b>Elizabeth Gillmor  </b><b><span style="font-size:7.5pt">PE, LC, LEED AP</span></b><u></u><u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#38761d;background:white">e n e r g e t i c s  </span></b><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#38761d">consulting engineers, llc</span></b><u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#666666;background:white"><a href="http://energetics-eng.com" target="_blank">energetics-eng.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#666666;background:white">c <a href="tel:303.619.0091" target="_blank">303.619.0091</a></span><u></u><u></u></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 3:26 AM, Omar ElRawy <<a href="mailto:omaroelrawy@gmail.com" target="_blank">omaroelrawy@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><b><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Dear all,</span></b><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><b><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">               I've got the following reply for a psz system in the baseline case during preliminary LEED design submittal:</span></b><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"> <u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><b><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">"</span></b><b><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#38761d">N</span></b><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#38761d">ote that section G3.1.2.1 requires that where efficiency ratings, such as EER and COP, include fan energy, the descriptor shall be broken down into its components so that supply fan energy can be modeled separately. Because the efficiency ratings are calculated at ARI-rated conditions, the fans should also be broken out at ARI-rated conditions. Most simulation software programs have the capability to perform this step automatically. Provide documentation showing that this calculation has been performed by the software automatically or provide calculations consistent with the ASHRAE 90.1-2007 User’s Manual showing that the calculation has been performed at ARI-rated conditions</span><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">."</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"> <u></u><u></u></p><p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline;outline:0px;background-image:initial;background-repeat:initial"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">What I did is that I referred to eQuest library, and documented the following paragraph to the reviewer:</span><u></u><u></u></p><p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline;outline:0px;background-image:initial;background-repeat:initial"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">"</span><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#783f04">COOLING-EIR:<br>The Electric Input Ratio (EIR), or 1/(Coefficient of Performance), for the cooling unit at ARI rated conditions..... This EIR is at ARI rated conditions, i.e., without correction for different temperature or part load. Note: If you include fan electric energy consumption in your value of COOLING-EIR, then you should set SUPPLY-KW/FLOW to zero. Otherwise, the supply fan electrical energy will be double counted........ Imbedding the fan energy into the COOLING-EIR is valid only if the fan is constant volume and INDOOR-FAN-MODE = INTERMITTENT; i.e. the fan cycles on/off with the compressor. If the fan runs continuously during occupied hours, or the fan is variable volume, then the fan energy cannot be included in the COOLING-EIR (or HEATING-EIR).</span><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">"</span><u></u><u></u></p><p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline;outline:0px;background-image:initial;background-repeat:initial"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">And I did set fan kw/cfm to zero, intermittent, and constant volume, but I've got the SV-A report reporting zero kw power demand, and zero fan (kw) for the system and its zones.</span><u></u><u></u></p><p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline;outline:0px;background-image:initial;background-repeat:initial"><u><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Then I got an advice stating that:</span></u><u></u><u></u></p><p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline;outline:0px;background-image:initial;background-repeat:initial"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">"You should do what the reviewer mentions, divide the indoor fan from the efficiency rating at ARI-rated conditions and model it separately; this way you will be able to report the appropriate fan power"</span><u></u><u></u></p><p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline;outline:0px;background-image:initial;background-repeat:initial"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">My question is:<b> where do I separately input the indoor fan power (kw), and what value should it be?, knowing that this is a baseline case that do not refer to an actual design.</b></span><u></u><u></u></p><p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline;outline:0px;background-image:initial;background-repeat:initial"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Thanks,</span><u></u><u></u></p><div><div><div><div><div><blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt;margin-top:0px!important;margin-bottom:0px!important"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:9.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222">Omar ElRawy, LEED AP BD+C</span></b><u></u><u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222">LEED Project Manager</span><u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222">EA Sustainable Building Consultants</span><u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#222222"><a href="http://www.ea-buildingconsultants.com/" target="_blank">http://www.ea-buildingconsultants.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>_______________________________________________<br>Equest-users mailing list<br><a href="http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/equest-users-onebuilding.org" target="_blank">http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/equest-users-onebuilding.org</a><br>To unsubscribe from this mailing list send  a blank message to <a href="mailto:EQUEST-USERS-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG" target="_blank">EQUEST-USERS-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG</a><u></u><u></u></p></div><p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p></div></div><div class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center"><hr size="2" width="100%" align="center"></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray"><br>You are receiving this communication because you are listed as a current WSP contact. Should you have any questions regarding WSP’s electronic communications policy, please consult our Anti-Spam Commitment <a href="http://www.wspgroup.com/casl" target="_blank">www.wspgroup.com/casl</a>. For any concern or if you believe you should not be receiving this message, please forward this message to us at <a href="mailto:caslcompliance@wspgroup.com" target="_blank">caslcompliance@wspgroup.com</a> so that we can promptly address your request. This message is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed, and may contain information which is privileged, confidential, proprietary or exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient or the person responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, you are strictly prohibited from disclosing, distributing, copying or in any way using this message. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender, and destroy and delete any copies you may have received. <br><br>WSP provides professional land surveying services through the following entities: WSP Surveys (AB) Limited Partnership and WSP Surveys (BC) Limited Partnership <u></u><u></u></span></p></div></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p></div></div></div><div class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center"><hr size="1" width="100%" noshade style="color:#a0a0a0" align="center"></div><p class="MsoNormal">No virus found in this message.<br>Checked by AVG - <a href="http://www.avg.com" target="_blank">www.avg.com</a><br>Version: 2014.0.4800 / Virus Database: 4311/9974 - Release Date: 06/08/15<u></u><u></u></p></div></div><br>_______________________________________________<br>
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