Hi，<br>You can input the EER in eQUEST wizard mode，and then click the finish button，the EIR generated by eQuest in detailed mode is what you want.And also you can calculate it per Elizabeth's suggestion.<br><br><br>Yongqingzhao<br><br/><div style="font-size:12px;padding:2px 0;">---原始邮件---</div><div style="font-size:12px;background:#f0f0f0;color:#212121;padding:8px!important;border-radius:4px;line-height:1.5;"><div><b>发件人:</b> "Elizabeth Gillmor"<elizabeth@energetics-eng.com></div><div><b>发送时间:</b> 2015年06月09日 22:09:31</div><div><b>收件人:</b> "Omar ElRawy"<omaroelrawy@gmail.com>;</div><div><b>抄送:</b> "equest"<equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org>;</div><div><b>主题:</b> Re: [Equest-users] Indoor fan separation at ARI</div></div><br/><div dir="ltr">I seem to get this comment frequently so I have it all typed out as a stock LEED comment response.  The advice you received is correct. You can use the following formulas for fan power and EIR:<div><br/></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:left"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">kW/cfm = BHP / 0.746 *
Fan Motor Efficiency     (<----from Appendix G)</span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:left"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:left"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">BHP = CFM * 0.0013 +
Pressure Drop Adjustment</span><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:left"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"><br/></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">The baseline
EIR is then calculated with fan energy modeled separately, using the following
formula (same as what eQuest uses in Wizard mode):</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"><br/></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"><span style="display:inline-block; background: #eee; padding: 3px 5px; line-height:1.5; font-size: 12px; color: #999">原文图片</span><br/></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"><br/></span></p><p align="center" class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"></span><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">Where ARI Fan
Power = fan power at rated ARI conditions (W/Btuh), and CAP = total cooling
capacity (Btuh).  At rated ARI
conditions, the supply fan is rated at 0.365 kW/cfm and 400 cfm/ton, such that:</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"><br/></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;line-height:107%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"></span><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"><span style="display:inline-block; background: #eee; padding: 3px 5px; line-height:1.5; font-size: 12px; color: #999">原文图片</span><br/></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"><br/></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;line-height:107%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"></span><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">When normalizing the
cooling capacity, the formula is:</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"><span style="display:inline-block; background: #eee; padding: 3px 5px; line-height:1.5; font-size: 12px; color: #999">原文图片</span><br/></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;line-height:107%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"></span><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"></span></p><p class="MsoNormal">
</p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"><br/></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">When applied to
a baseline EER=9.5, the resulting EIR=0.3051.  The eQuest wizard will also do this for you correctly, but usually at LEED submittal time we are all well past the wizard phase, so the formulas above are handy to have.  </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"><br/></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial, sans-serif">Good luck!</font></p><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial, sans-serif">Elizabeth</font></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:left"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"><br/></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"><br/></span></p></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br/><div><div class="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><b>Elizabeth Gillmor  <font size="1">PE, LC, LEED AP</font></b><div><br/></div><div><span style="font-size:large;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"><b><font color="#38761d" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">e n e r g e t i c s  </font></b></span><b><font color="#38761d" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">consulting engineers, llc</font></b></div><div><font color="#666666" size="2" style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"><a href="http://energetics-eng.com" target="_blank">energetics-eng.com</a></font></div><div><span style="font-size:small;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"><font color="#666666">c 303.619.0091</font></span><br/></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
<br/><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 3:26 AM, Omar ElRawy <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:omaroelrawy@gmail.com" target="_blank">omaroelrawy@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br/><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0.0001pt;text-align:justify"><b><font color="#000000" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Dear all,</font></b></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0.0001pt;text-align:justify"><b><font color="#000000" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">               I've got the following reply for a psz system in the baseline case during preliminary LEED design submittal:</font></b></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0.0001pt;text-align:justify"><b><font color="#000000" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><br/></font></b></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0.0001pt;text-align:justify"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><b><font color="#000000">"</font><font color="#38761d">N</font></b><font color="#38761d">ote that
section G3.1.2.1 requires that where efficiency ratings, such as EER and COP, include
fan energy, the descriptor shall be broken down into its components so that
supply fan energy can be modeled separately. Because the efficiency ratings are
calculated at ARI-rated conditions, the fans should also be broken out at
ARI-rated conditions. Most simulation software programs have the capability to
perform this step automatically. Provide documentation showing that this
calculation has been performed by the software automatically or provide
calculations consistent with the ASHRAE 90.1-2007 User’s Manual showing that
the calculation has been performed at ARI-rated conditions</font></font><font color="#000000" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">."</font></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:0.0001pt;text-align:justify"><font color="#000000" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><br/></font></p><p style="margin:0px;padding:0px 0px 10px;border:0px;outline:0px;vertical-align:baseline;line-height:1.5;background-image:initial;background-repeat:initial"><font color="#000000" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">What I did is that I referred to eQuest library, and documented the following paragraph to the reviewer:</font></p><p style="margin:0px;padding:0px 0px 10px;border:0px;outline:0px;vertical-align:baseline;line-height:1.5;background-image:initial;background-repeat:initial"><font color="#000000" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">"</font><font color="#783f04" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">COOLING-EIR:<br/>The Electric Input Ratio (EIR), or 1/(Coefficient of Performance), for the cooling unit at ARI rated conditions..... This EIR is at ARI rated conditions, i.e., without correction for different temperature or part load. Note: If you include fan electric energy consumption in your value of COOLING-EIR, then you should set SUPPLY-KW/FLOW to zero. Otherwise, the supply fan electrical energy will be double counted........ Imbedding the fan energy into the COOLING-EIR is valid only if the fan is constant volume and INDOOR-FAN-MODE = INTERMITTENT; i.e. the fan cycles on/off with the compressor. If the fan runs continuously during occupied hours, or the fan is variable volume, then the fan energy cannot be included in the COOLING-EIR (or HEATING-EIR).</font><font color="#000000" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">"</font></p><p style="margin:0px;padding:0px 0px 10px;border:0px;outline:0px;vertical-align:baseline;line-height:1.5;background-image:initial;background-repeat:initial"><font color="#000000" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">And I did set fan kw/cfm to zero, intermittent, and constant volume, but I've got the SV-A report reporting zero kw power demand, and zero fan (kw) for the system and its zones.</font></p><p style="margin:0px;padding:0px 0px 10px;border:0px;outline:0px;vertical-align:baseline;line-height:1.5;background-image:initial;background-repeat:initial"><font color="#000000" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><u>Then I got an advice stating that:</u></font></p><p style="margin:0px;padding:0px 0px 10px;border:0px;outline:0px;vertical-align:baseline;line-height:1.5;background-image:initial;background-repeat:initial"><font color="#000000" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">"<span style="line-height:19.2000007629395px">You should do what the reviewer mentions, divide the indoor fan from the efficiency rating at ARI-rated conditions and model it separately; this way you will be able to report the appropriate fan power"</span></font></p><p style="margin:0px;padding:0px 0px 10px;border:0px;outline:0px;vertical-align:baseline;line-height:1.5;background-image:initial;background-repeat:initial"><font color="#000000" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">My question is:<b><span style="line-height:19.2000007629395px"> </span><span style="line-height:19.2000007629395px">where do I separately input the indoor fan power (kw), and what value should it be?, knowing that this is a baseline case that do not refer to an actual design.</span></b></font></p><p style="margin:0px;padding:0px 0px 10px;border:0px;outline:0px;vertical-align:baseline;background-image:initial;background-repeat:initial"><font color="#000000" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><span style="line-height:19.2000007629395px">Thanks,</span></font></p><div><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><blockquote style="padding:0px;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;font-size:16px;border:none;margin-top:0px!important;margin-bottom:0px!important"><b style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8000001907349px">Omar ElRawy, LEED AP BD+C</b><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8000001907349px">LEED Project Manager</div><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8000001907349px">EA Sustainable Building Consultants</div><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8000001907349px"><a href="http://www.ea-buildingconsultants.com/" target="_blank">http://www.ea-buildingconsultants.com</a></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div></div>
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