<div>Have not followed the thread in detail - but here are some things I have found about windows - first off not a whole lot of saving at the yearly-building level. If you look at the peak breakdown for a window - the U-value related conductance is 2/3rds vs the solar radiation (1/3rd) - atleast for the one model that I was looking at. As others have noted, almost 40-50% of the energy consumption is from lights/plug loads.</div>
<div> </div><div>You might want to look at just the perimeter zones and see what happens to the energy consumption reduction in just those zones?</div><div> </div><div>You can also look at just the LS-D reports to see what the % savings are. Sometimes it helps in saying that reductions are x% of the cooling load (without considering the HVAC inefficiencies) - which will be a higher number.</div>
<div> </div><div><br><br> </div><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, May 31, 2012 at 9:16 AM, Nick Caton <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:ncaton@smithboucher.com" target="_blank">ncaton@smithboucher.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:11pt">Feeling confident in your modeling approach is very much important, but before running deep into alternate methods, I would seek perspective on what % improvement
is even feasible. Perhaps a 1% net improvement is quite impressive, all things considered? Considering static shades can be simultaneously helpful and harmful thermally over a year, a few iterations exploring different transmittance values may be enlightening.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:11pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:11pt">Doing so, you might be able to establish a ceiling for maximum possible improvement with such shades, and suggest a more optimized exoskeleton spacing or similar.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:11pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:11pt">There may also be a lesson in here about how to present results in a fashion that both informs and appeases the design team. Perhaps the shades may not have
an impressive net annual baseline % improvement, but significant thermal comfort and glare issues are averted, and cooling plant capacities can be lowered by slicing the summertime solar loads…. I would also caution to check the solar loads are indeed cutting
down as anticipated if you aren’t sure of your approach.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:11pt">Best of luck!<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:11pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:11pt">~Nick<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:11pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:11pt"><img alt="cid:489575314@22072009-0ABB" src="cid:image001.jpg@01CD3F0C.22E91330" width="119" height="37"></span><b><span style="color:rgb(45,77,94);font-family:"Stylus BT","sans-serif";font-size:11pt"><u></u><u></u></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:rgb(45,77,94);font-family:"Stylus BT","sans-serif";font-size:11pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:rgb(45,77,94);font-family:"Stylus BT","sans-serif"">NICK CATON, P.E.</span></b><b><span style="color:rgb(45,77,94);font-family:"Stylus BT","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(204,153,0);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:7.5pt">SENIOR ENGINEER<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(204,153,0);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:7.5pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(45,77,94);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:10pt">Smith & Boucher Engineers</span><span style="color:rgb(204,153,0);font-size:7.5pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(45,77,94);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:10pt">25501 west valley parkway, suite 200<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(45,77,94);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:10pt">olathe, ks 66061<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(45,77,94);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:10pt">direct <a href="tel:913.344.0036" target="_blank" value="+19133440036">913.344.0036</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(45,77,94);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:10pt">fax <a href="tel:913.345.0617" target="_blank" value="+19133450617">913.345.0617</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:11pt"><a title="blocked::www.smithboucher.com" href="http://www.smithboucher.com" target="_blank"><span style="color:blue;font-size:10pt">www.smithboucher.com</span></a></span><u><span style="color:blue;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:10pt">
</span></u><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:11pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-size:11pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";font-size:10pt">From:</span></b><span style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";font-size:10pt"> <a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Umesh Atre<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, May 31, 2012 8:30 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Bobby Sy; <a href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] building shade effect<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";font-size:10pt"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Bob,</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">What is the project location and how is the building oriented? Do these louvers run across the entire height of the building?</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">If you have a heavily internal load dominated (office) building, the building skin effect might be minimal, but then again the shading design</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:blue;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">you have in this project looks pretty dense and assuming you have a need for cooling, my gut feeling is that 1% is on the lower side.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p style="margin-bottom:12pt" class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";font-size:10pt">From:</span></b><span style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";font-size:10pt">
<a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a> [<a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Bobby Sy<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, May 30, 2012 10:19 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Equest-users] building shade effect</span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Hello everyone!<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I am working on a project, a high rise office building. The architect added louvers as part of the design which I admire for sophistication. Attached is a picture that shows the louvers outside for shading. But, when I did the initial run,
the effect of the louvers is only around 1% energy improvement from the baseline.<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Please let me know if there is a better way to do it in eQuest. What I did was to measure the louver thickness and proportioned it to the glass area that it covers. I put the fraction as "Transmittance:" in Building and Fixed Shades properties.
Doe 2 help says: <u></u><u></u></p>
<h5><span style="color:rgb(102,102,0)">TRANSMITTANCE</span><u></u><u></u></h5>
<p><span style="color:rgb(102,102,0)">Fraction of incident solar radiation that is transmitted by the shading surface. The default value is 0.0, which means the surface is opaque. A value greater than 0.0 represents a device that passes some solar
radiation, such as a tree, lattice, or fabric. Using SHADE-SCHEDULE allows seasonal variation in transmittance. Daylighting calculation assumes TRANSMITTANCE = 0.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">The design team quite find it hard to believe that the louvers have very minimal effect. I told them to consider the window to wall ratio (almost 60%) and that fact that they will be using a clear glass, even with these louvers partial
UV rays still pass through the gaps that spreads allover the glass surface that adds to the heat load for air conditioning. Ive noticed to some of my other projects in tropical countries, building shades don't have much effect to energy efficiency. Did anyone
encounter the same result with building shades? <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks,<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Bob<u></u><u></u></p>
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