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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Thank you very much for your thoughts. This is very helpful.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Regards -<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#006E78'>Jeff Ross-Bain, PE, </span></b><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#006E78'>L</span><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#006E78'>EED AP BD+C</span><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#535053'><br>Principal<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#535053'>404-220-8940 Office<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#535053'>404-220-8955 Direct<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#006E78'><a href="http://www.rbgb.com/">www.rbgb.com</a></span></b><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#535053'><br><br></span><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#006E78'>Build Green. Save Time<b><o:p></o:p></b></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Rob Hudson [mailto:rdh4176@gmail.com] <br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 15, 2012 7:26 AM<br><b>To:</b> James Hess<br><b>Cc:</b> Jeff Ross-Bain; equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] Modeling a non-existing cooling system<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>As long as the cooling thermostat setpoints are identical in both models, USGBC should approve of it. We have done this on numerous projects for small storage spaces and stairwells.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Rob<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 6:14 PM, James Hess <<a href="mailto:JHess@tmecorp.com">JHess@tmecorp.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I believe you have to include the cooling system in the model (per ASHRAE), but with the cooling thermostat set-point set high (i.e. up to 90 degrees), per USGBC, which effectively makes this a moot point. Is the cooling system in the model? Yes, we met the modeling requirement. Does it have any impact on the savings? The answer would be no.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>That is how I would handle this situation.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I have seen this written down somewhere, maybe a USGBC interpretation, just cannot remember where I saw this. </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#339966'> </span></b><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#339966'>JAH</span></b><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#339966'> </span></b><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#339966'>James A. Hess, PE, CEM, BEMP</span></i></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><br>Energy Engineer<br>TME, Inc.<br>Little Rock, AR</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Mobile: <a href="tel:%28501%29%20351-4667" target="_blank">(501) 351-4667</a></span><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> <a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Jeff Ross-Bain<br><b>Sent:</b> Friday, March 09, 2012 1:59 PM<br><b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br><b>Subject:</b> [Equest-users] Modeling a non-existing cooling system</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Hi All,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>From my understanding of ASHRAE 90.1 Appendix G Table G3.1 (10) and the User’s Manual, if a space has no cooling system, and it is a conditioned space (i.e. NOT semiheated), then that space must have a cooling system modeled and it would be identical for the proposed and baseline cases. I completely understand the logic of this requirement – in most cases.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>However, I am working on a fire station where the apparatus bay (the fire trucks) are in a 4,000+ sq ft space that is heated only, but is a conditioned space and not a semiheated space. This space is almost half of the building area, will not be cooled, has large overhead doors that are mostly open, and is a place where diesel engines run. </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Does anyone out there know of any exception, or interpretation, to this modeling rule for specific cases such as a fire station where a space can be modeled as heated only for the baseline and proposed cases? The model will be submitted for LEED review. I can certainly model a cooling system but it does not seem to make sense in this case.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Thanks for your input and I really appreciate this forum.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Cheers!</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#006E78'>Jeff Ross-Bain, PE, </span></b><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#006E78'>LEED AP BD+C</span><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#535053'><br>Principal</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#535053'><a href="tel:404-220-8940" target="_blank">404-220-8940</a> Office</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#535053'><a href="tel:404-220-8955" target="_blank">404-220-8955</a> Direct</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#006E78'><a href="http://www.rbgb.com/" target="_blank">www.rbgb.com</a></span></b><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#535053'><br><br></span><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Century Gothic","sans-serif";color:#006E78'>Build Green. Save Time</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>_______________________________________________<br>Equest-users mailing list<br><a href="http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/equest-users-onebuilding.org" target="_blank">http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/equest-users-onebuilding.org</a><br>To unsubscribe from this mailing list send a blank message to <a href="mailto:EQUEST-USERS-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG">EQUEST-USERS-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG</a><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br clear=all><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal>-- <br>Rob Hudson<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></body></html>