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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Dear all,</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Thank you for your responses.</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font></p>
<ol style='margin-top:0cm' start=1 type=1>
<li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Are the NFRC testing and the
values in table A8.2 used for the Baseline, Proposed, or both scenarios?</span></font></li>
</ol>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:18.0pt'><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font></p>
<ol style='margin-top:0cm' start=2 type=1>
<li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Let’s say I do not have
NFRC test results and decide to use the values in table A8.2. For a clear
double glazed and metal frame type, I get an assembly U-factor of 5.1. How
can I input this into eQUEST? As far as I know, I can enter the glass
properties and the frame properties. Do I have to play with the glass
properties and check the LV-D report for the calculated Assembly u-value?</span></font></li>
</ol>
<p class=MsoNormal style='text-indent:36.0pt'><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Similarly,
for the baseline, Tables 5.5-1 to 5.5-8 of ASHRAE 90.1 provide the assembly
u-values for vertical glazing. How can I enter these values into eQUEST?</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:18.0pt'><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font></p>
<ol style='margin-top:0cm' start=3 type=1>
<li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>I am attaching the specs of the
proposed glazing. These numbers are for the glass only (note that the
u-values reported are NFRC ones). Additionally, I know that the frame will
be aluminium. Do I still need NFRC U-values for the whole assembly, or is
the NFRC usually for the glass only? If yes, how can I calculate the whole
assembly U-value (given that eQUEST doesn’t have the ability to
calculate this)</span></font></li>
</ol>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Thanks for clarifying this, as my project
is outside the US and we are not too familiar with standards such as NFRC.</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> </span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Best regards,</span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Omar</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>___________________________</span></font><font
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Omar Katanani</span></font><font
color=navy><span style='color:navy'><br>
</span></font><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Sustainable Design Engineer</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Email: <a
href="mailto:omar@ecoconsulting.net">omar@ecoconsulting.net</a></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=navy face="Times New Roman"><span
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<p style='margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> <img border=0
width=870 height=102 src="cid:image001.jpg@01CC4D3C.3C1494A0"></span></font></p>
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<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
Robby Oylear [mailto:robbyoylear@gmail.com] <br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> 28 July 2011 00:53<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> Omar Katanani<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></b> Brad Robinson;
equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [Equest-users]
URGENT: Window U-values: Total window assembly v/s Glass only</span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Omar,</span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>To directly answer your question:</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>"</span></font><span class=apple-style-span><font size=1
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>I’m assuming that, given that I entered the u-values for the
glass only, and then I entered information about the frame, then I need not
worry about any conversions in U-values, <u>since eQUEST has all the
necessary information to calculate the equivalent u-value of the whole pane +
frame assembly,</u>right?</span></font></span>"</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>No. Your method will result in an assembly U-value based on your
input glass conductance and whatever default frame properties that the eQUEST
wizard will use. I have never tried to let eQUEST determine an assembly
value, as NFRC values are required for LEED and code compliance studies.
I would not be surprised if the values eQUEST is calculating (shown in
LV-D and LV-E reports like previously mentioned) are much different than what
you'll actually see in the test results.</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Again, NFRC values are a LEED requirement, so unless you're just doing
preliminary analysis for a client, you need to receive NFRC simulation reports
or certified product directory numbers in accordance with NFRC 100.</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-top:1.0pt'><b><span style='mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast'><font
size=2 color="#632423" face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Verdana;color:#632423;font-weight:bold'>Robby Oylear, LEED</span><sup>®</sup><span
style='mso-fareast-theme-font:
minor-fareast'> AP BD+C</span></span></font></b></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast'><font
size=1 color=black face=Verdana><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:Verdana;
color:black;font-style:italic'>Mechanical Project Engineer</span></span></font></i></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast'><font
size=1 color=black face=Verdana><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:Verdana;
color:black;font-style:italic'>Energy Analyst</span></span></font></i></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast'><font
size=1 color=black face=Verdana><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:Verdana;
color:black;font-style:italic'> </span></span></font></i></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='line-height:115%'><b><span style='mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast'><font
size=1 color="#632423" face=Verdana><span style='font-size:8.0pt;line-height:
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size=1 color="#1f497d" face=Verdana><span style='font-size:8.0pt;line-height:
115%;font-family:Verdana;color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast'>
</span></font><font size=1 color=black face=Verdana><span style='font-size:
8.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Verdana;color:black'></span><span
style='mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast'>206-788-4571 |</span></span></font><font
size=1 color="#bfab7f" face=Verdana><span style='font-size:8.0pt;line-height:
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font-family:Verdana;color:black'></span><span style='mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast'>206-354-2721</span></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='line-height:115%'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;line-height:115%'><a href="http://www.rushingco.com/"><b><i><span
style='mso-fareast-theme-font:
minor-fareast'><font size=1 color="#632423"
face=Verdana><span style='font-size:8.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Verdana;
color:#632423;font-weight:bold;font-style:italic'>www.rushingco.com</span></span></font></i></b></a></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> </span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>On Wed, Jul 27, 2011 at 2:44 PM, <<a
href="mailto:omar@ecoconsulting.net">omar@ecoconsulting.net</a>> wrote:</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Dear Robby,<br>
<br>
Yes, I am modeling for LEED purposes.<br>
I'll look into A8.2. But at least, is my method correct for the proposed
scenario?<br>
<br>
Brad: I think you need to enter the center of glass u-value in the "Glass
Type", and then enter the frame properties in the "Window"
properties...<br>
<br>
Best,<br>
Omar</span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'><br>
<br>
Quoting Brad Robinson <<a href="mailto:brad.robinson@yahoo.com"
target="_blank">brad.robinson@yahoo.com</a>>:</span></font></p>
</div>
<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;
margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm'>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><br>
<br>
Is the u-value listed for a manufacturer and specific model on the NRCAN
website centre of glass or overall assembly? Many windows are custom made
to suit so I am unclear if each individual custom window would need to be
tested.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
In eQuest, when entering the window, if the u-value represents the whole
window, including frame, do you need to enter a frame width, conductance etc as
well under the Window Frame section under Window Properties? Thanks.<br>
<br>
<br>
Brad Robinson<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
________________________________<br>
From: Robby Oylear <<a href="mailto:robbyoylear@gmail.com" target="_blank">robbyoylear@gmail.com</a>><br>
To: Omar Katanani <<a href="mailto:omar@ecoconsulting.net" target="_blank">omar@ecoconsulting.net</a>><br>
Cc: <a href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2011 12:32:08 PM<br>
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] URGENT: Window U-values: Total window assembly v/s
Glass only<br>
<br>
<br>
Omar,<br>
<br>
The answer depends on the purpose of your study. If you're trying to get
results for a client on the impact of the glazing on their energy performance,
this may be adequate. Make sure you've entered in the framing information
properly (metal vs. non-metal).<br>
<br>
I'd recommend opening up your simulation output results file (xxxx.SIM) and
going to the either the last page of the LV-D report or sort through your LV-E
report to see what value eQUEST has calculated. Compare these values to the
ASHRAE Fundamentals results for overall assembly values including frame to see
how close you've come. I would not blindly trust that eQUEST will give
you an appropriate overall assembly value based on entering only the center of
glass number.<br>
<br>
However, if this is for a LEED study, this is not adequate. This an
excerpt from an e-mail I sent out recently regarding LEED and NFRC
requirements.<br>
<br>
In order to meet LEED EAp2 Minimum Energy Performance, the project must comply
with all mandatory provisions of ASHRAE 90.1-2007. Section 5.4.2
Fenestration and Doors requires that fenestration performance be determined per
section 5.8.2. Section 5.8.2.4 U-factor requires that the U-factor for
the overall fenestration area (including framing) be determined in accordance
with NFRC 100. If you do not have NFRC data available, values from section A8.2
are the only acceptable alternative.<br>
<br>
Robby Oylear, LEED®AP BD+C<br>
Mechanical Project Engineer<br>
Energy Analyst<br>
</span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>D206-788-4571 |C206-354-2721</span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><br>
<a href="http://www.rushingco.com" target="_blank">www.rushingco.com</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On Wed, Jul 27, 2011 at 8:14 AM, Omar Katanani <<a
href="mailto:omar@ecoconsulting.net" target="_blank">omar@ecoconsulting.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
<br>
Dear all,</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> <br>
I have a small question regarding entering</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>window properties to eQUEST:</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> <br>
I have read a lot of emails in the forum</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>discussing NFRC testing, LBNL Window 5 import, and other topics that I
haven?t<br>
paid attention to before.</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> <br>
The way I modelled my windows is the</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>following:</span></font></p>
</div>
<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;
margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm'>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> <br>
1. I have manufacturer?s specifications listing the
glass U-values, not the total assembly.<br>
2. In the ?Glass Types? (eQUEST Detailed Mode), I
created glass types, and entered the glass conductance, visible transmittance,
SC, and emissivity from the manufacturer?s details I have.<br>
3. When creating windows, I specify which glass type
(from the ones I created in step 2), in addition to the frame width and
conductance.</span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><br>
<br>
I?m assuming that, given that I</span></font></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>entered the u-values for the glass only, and then I entered information
about<br>
the frame, then I need not worry about any conversions in U-values, since<br>
eQUEST has all the necessary information to calculate the equivalent u-value of<br>
the whole pane + frame assembly, right?</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'> <br>
I appreciate your feedback / comments</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>today if possible, as this has become really urgent!</span></font></p>
</div>
<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;
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Many thanks,<br>
Omar<br>
___________________________<br>
Omar Katanani<br>
Sustainable Design Engineer<br>
Email: <a href="mailto:omar@ecoconsulting.net" target="_blank">omar@ecoconsulting.net</a><br>
<br>
EcoConsulting (Lebanon)</span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>NahasBuilding, 4th floor</span></font></p>
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12.0pt'><br>
4 St-Maron Street/ Georges Haddad Avenue<br>
Postal Code: 2028 5806</span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>SAIFI</span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>Beirut</span></font>, Lebanon<br>
Tel: <a
href="tel:%2B961%20%280%29%201%20971%20266" target="_blank" value="+9611971266">+961
(0) 1 971 266</a><br>
Mobile: <a href="tel:%2B961%20%280%29%203%20045%20045"
target="_blank" value="+9613045045">+961 (0) 3 045 045</a><br>
<br>
EcoConsulting (UK) Ltd<br>
28 Marshalsea Road<br>
London, SE1 1HF<br>
Tel: <a href="tel:%2B44%20%280%29%20207%20939%200989" target="_blank"
value="+442079390989">+44 (0) 207 939 0989</a><br>
Fax: <a href="tel:%2B44%20%280%29%20207%20939%200981" target="_blank"
value="+442079390981">+44 (0) 207 939 0981</a><br>
Website: <a href="http://www.ecoconsulting.net" target="_blank">www.ecoconsulting.net</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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<br>
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