As you know, App-G does not provide guidance for if/how neighboring buildings are modeled as long as the decision is consistent in both baseline and proposed cases. Would be curious to hear about the approach others take to this, e.g. model both with and without and then choose the most beneficial option, as far as PRM.<div>
<br></div><div><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Apr 28, 2011 at 7:27 PM, Lyle Keck <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:lkeck@aeieng.com">lkeck@aeieng.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div bgcolor="white" lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">I know of a work-around to make an exterior surface (wall/flr/roof) into an adiabatic surface if you already have an adiabatic surface somewhere in your model.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">These instructions are for detailed mode and I will try to explain them as clearly as I can.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"><br>So let’s say you have an existing adiabatic/interior surface in your model, we will call this surface INTERIOR-1 for reference.</span></p><p class="MsoNormal">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Let’s name the current exterior surface that you would like to make adiabatic/interior surface EXTERIOR-1 for reference. </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">First start by selecting surface EXTERIOR-1 in the project tree under ‘building shell’. Right click this surface and select properties. On scrap paper, copy the parent space as well as all of the information under location & geometry (loc/poly/x/y/z/Azimuth/area/height/width/tilt/ etc..). This will allow you to recreate the surface you wish to change in exactly the same shape and location. Exit out of EXTERIOR-1 properties.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Next, click on the existing adiabatic/interior surface named INTERIOR-1 and select ‘create another interior wall’. Name the new interior wall name something close to the name for exterior-1 or the surface you wish to replace. Select the parent space that you copied down for EXTERIOR-1. For create option, select copy an existing component and select INTERIOR-1 from the dropdown. Click ok. A new interior surface properties box should come up and you should see ‘adiabatic’ selected under surface type. In this new box, copy all of the location and geometry information that you took down for EXTERIOR-1. Sometimes the correct info will already be there and sometimes you will have to input the values you copied down (depending on if it’s a space polygon or not?). Click OK.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"><br>TADAA! You should now have an adiabatic interior surface in exactly the same place as the exterior surface you were trying to change. Once you are sure the surface is correct, delete the original EXTERIOR-1 as you will have two identical surfaces on top of each other. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">I hope this helps, I have used this method to make adiabatic interior surfaces for models with multiple shells as well as models that are adjacent to existing buildings. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></p><table border="0" cellpadding="0" width="474" style="width:355.5pt">
<tbody><tr><td width="167" valign="top" style="width:125.25pt;padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#660000;text-transform:uppercase">Lyle Keck</span></b><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;color:#333333"> </span></b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;color:#333333"><br>
</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#333333;text-transform:uppercase">SustainablE Systems Analyst</span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;color:#333333"></span></p></td><td width="10" valign="top" style="width:7.5pt;padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;color:#333333"> </span></p></td><td width="283" valign="top" style="width:212.25pt;padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;color:#660000">AEI</span></b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;color:#333333"> | AFFILIATED ENGINEERS, INC. <br>
Westlake Center Office Tower, 1601 Fifth Avenue, Suite 1400 | Seattle, WA 98101<br><br></span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;color:#660000">P: <a href="tel:206.256.0800" value="+12062560800" target="_blank">206.256.0800</a> | F: <a href="tel:206.256.0423" value="+12062560423" target="_blank">206.256.0423</a></span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;color:#333333"> <br>
</span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;color:#660000"><a href="mailto:lkeck@aeieng.com" target="_blank"><span style="color:#660000;text-decoration:none">lkeck@aeieng.com</span></a> | </span><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;color:#660000"><a href="http://www.aeieng.com/" target="_blank"><span style="color:#660000;text-decoration:none">www.aeieng.com</span></a></span></b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;color:#333333"> </span></p>
</td></tr></tbody></table><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></p><div><div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt"> Mark Darrall [mailto:<a href="mailto:MDarrall@a2so4.com" target="_blank">MDarrall@a2so4.com</a>] <br><b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, April 27, 2011 1:56 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Deepika; Arpan Bakshi</span></p><div><div></div><div class="h5"><br><b>Cc:</b> equest-users<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] External Adiabatic</div></div><p></p></div></div><div><div></div><div class="h5">
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 55"">I like that. It’s elegant. eQ still wanted Constructions and Layers, so I set the overall U to 0.001 and used an interior wall construction.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 55""> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 55"">Thanks!</span></p><p class="MsoNormal">
<span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 55""> </span></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 45 Light";color:#333333">MARK DARRALL, AIA, LEED AP BD+C, NCARB<br>
Senior Project Manager</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 45 Light";color:#333333"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 45 Light";color:#333333"><img border="0" width="136" height="55" src="?ui=2&ik=8d56e79bd6&view=att&th=12f9e7004c29c9b7&attid=0.1&disp=emb&zw" alt="a2so4-email"></span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 45 Light";color:#333333"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:.5in"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 45 Light""> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 45 Light"">DESIGN ENRICHING LIFE // LIFE ENRICHING DESIGN</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 45 Light";color:#333333">A2SO4 Architecture, LLC</span></p><p class="MsoNormal">
<span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 45 Light";color:#333333">Union Station</span><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 45 Light""><br><span style="color:#333333">300 South Meridian Street / 250</span><br>
<span style="color:#333333">Indianapolis</span>, <span style="color:#333333">Indiana</span> <span style="color:#333333">46225</span><br>TEL <a href="tel:317%20388%208850" value="+13173888850" target="_blank">317 388 8850</a></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 45 Light"">FAX <a href="tel:317%20280%200692" value="+13172800692" target="_blank">317 280 0692</a></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 45 Light"">MOB <a href="tel:765%20749%200841" value="+17657490841" target="_blank">765 749 0841</a><br>
<span style="color:#333333"><a href="http://www.a2so4.com" target="_blank">www.a2so4.com</a></span></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:8.0pt;color:green">Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:green">.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:navy"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#333333"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 45 Light""></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;color:#333333">CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you may not review, copy or distribute this message. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original message. Neither the sender nor the company for which he or she works accepts any liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this email.</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"></span></p>
</div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Univers LT 55""> </span></p><div><div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt"> <a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Deepika<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, April 27, 2011 10:13 AM<br><b>To:</b> Arpan Bakshi<br><b>Cc:</b> equest-users<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] External Adiabatic</span></p></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"> </p><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">
I think the u value can be changed to 0.001 to male the wall with almost zero heat transfer when in detailed mode. I tried doing that n it worked. </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>On Apr 27, 2011, at 7:06 AM, Arpan Bakshi <<a href="mailto:arpanbakshi@gmail.com" target="_blank">arpanbakshi@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</p>
</div><blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Yes, the problem here is I am deep into detailed mode. Looks like we have to crack open the text edit again.</p></div><div><div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"> </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span>Thanks</span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span>Arpan</span></p></div></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">
<br>On Apr 27, 2011, at 9:55 AM, "Chris Swanson" <<a href="mailto:cswanson@rdfa.com" target="_blank">cswanson@rdfa.com</a>> wrote:</p></div><blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><div><div>
<p>See below. Nick gives a good explanation when I posed the same question a couple weeks ago.</p><p> </p><p>Chris Swanson, EI</p><p>Mechanical Design Engineer</p><p>Roger D. Fields & Associates</p><p><a href="tel:%28614%29%20451-2248" value="+16144512248" target="_blank">(614) 451-2248</a></p>
<p> </p><p>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------</p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">“A suggestion for you both:</span></p><p class="MsoNormal">
<span style="color:#1F497D"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">Right click any side of a shell during DD wizards at the zone definition screen (after any custom footprint/zoning patterns) to make that wall section “entirely adiabatic.” This sidesteps making any extra shells/systems and avoids having to back any figures out later. Screengrab following illustrates where I’m talking about – results in the background. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">You can accomplish the same net effect in detailed mode in various ways, but I think this is probably the easiest/fastest approach if you know from the start you want to model only part of a building with exterior exposures. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"><image001.png></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal">
<span style="color:#1F497D">Best of luck!</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D">~Nick</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"><image002.jpg></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:#2D4D5E"> </span></b></p><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:#2D4D5E">NICK CATON, E.I.T.</span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:7.5pt;color:#CC9900">PROJECT ENGINEER</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E">Smith & Boucher Engineers</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E">25501 west valley parkway</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E">olathe ks 66061</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E">direct <a href="tel:913%20344.0036" value="+19133440036" target="_blank">913 344.0036</a></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E">fax <a href="tel:913%20345.0617" value="+19133450617" target="_blank">913 345.0617</a></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"><a href="http://www.smithboucher.com" title="blocked::www.smithboucher.com" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">www.smithboucher.com</span></a></span><u><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:blue"> </span></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1F497D"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt"> <a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Bruce Easterbrook<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, April 06, 2011 9:58 AM<br><b>To:</b> Chris Swanson<br><b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] How to model part of a building?</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt">You have the right idea. Depending on the building of course, but I try to lump the part you aren't concerned about onto one AHU, and default everything in that portion. You are only concerned about the intersecting wall and it's condition. Add your other AHU's and zoning for the portion you want to work on. With the one extra AHU is makes it relatively easy to back out its numbers from the building analysis and you are left with what you want.<br>
Bruce Easterbrook P.Eng.<br>Abode Engineering<br></span><br>On 06/04/2011 10:15 AM, Chris Swanson wrote: </p><p class="MsoNormal">Hello all,</p><p class="MsoNormal"> </p><p class="MsoNormal">I’m looking for recommendations of how to model just one section of a building in eQUEST. Three sides are exterior walls, while the fourth is connected to the rest of the building, and therefore next to a conditioned space. Would the best method be to just use two separate shells (1 – the building “wing” I’m analyzing, 2 – the rest of the building), although I’m only concerned with one of them? Is there a better way to do this? I’m hoping someone can point me in the right direction. </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p><p class="MsoNormal">Thanks,</p><p class="MsoNormal"> </p><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:14.0pt">Chris Swanson, EI</span></b></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Mechanical Design Engineer</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Roger D. Fields & Associates</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Columbus, Ohio 43220-2777</span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">E-mail: <a href="mailto:cswanson@rdfa.com" target="_blank">cswanson@rdfa.com</a>”</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p><pre> </pre><pre> </pre><pre>_______________________________________________</pre><pre>Equest-users mailing list</pre><pre><a href="http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/equest-users-onebuilding.org" target="_blank">http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/equest-users-onebuilding.org</a></pre>
<pre>To unsubscribe from this mailing list send a blank message to <a href="mailto:EQUEST-USERS-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG" target="_blank">EQUEST-USERS-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG</a></pre><p> </p><p> </p><p>-----Original Message-----<br>
From: <a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>] On Behalf Of Arpan Bakshi<br>
Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2011 9:48 AM<br>To: equest-users<br>Subject: [Equest-users] External Adiabatic</p><p> </p><p>I can't find this thread I remember seeing about turning an exterior surface adiabatic where new construction meets existing building, ideas?</p>
<p> </p><p> </p><p> </p><p> </p><p>Arpan Bakshi, LEED AP BD+C</p><p>YRG sustainability</p><p>_______________________________________________</p><p>Equest-users mailing list</p><p><a href="http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/equest-users-onebuilding.org" target="_blank"><span style="color:windowtext;text-decoration:none">http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/equest-users-onebuilding.org</span></a></p>
<p>To unsubscribe from this mailing list send a blank message to <a href="mailto:EQUEST-USERS-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG" target="_blank"><span style="color:windowtext;text-decoration:none">EQUEST-USERS-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG</span></a></p>
</div></div></blockquote></div></blockquote><blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><div><p class="MsoNormal">_______________________________________________<br>Equest-users mailing list<br><a href="http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/equest-users-onebuilding.org" target="_blank">http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/equest-users-onebuilding.org</a><br>
To unsubscribe from this mailing list send a blank message to <a href="mailto:EQUEST-USERS-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG" target="_blank">EQUEST-USERS-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG</a></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div>
</div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br><div><br></div><div><b><font size="2"><br></font></b></div><div><b><p>Arpan Bakshi<span style="border-collapse:collapse;font-family:arial, sans-serif;font-weight:normal"></span><b style="font-weight:normal"><span style="border-collapse:collapse;font-family:arial, sans-serif;font-weight:normal"><i> </i>LEED AP BD+C</span></b><span style="color:rgb(64, 64, 64);font-size:12px;font-weight:normal"></span></p>
</b></div><br>
</div>