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<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy">Hello,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy">This is a newly near and dear issue to me as I obtained my PE license last year. My company is now (rightly so) leveraging my licensure
to offer the 179D tax cetification services via modeling. The difficultly is in pricing this service given the high level of simulation detail required for both ASHRAE 90.1 baseline modeling. Although I’ve been doing modeling since 2001 (3-4 per year), given
the number of 90.1 models we have done to date (small) the time it’s taking times the appropriate billing rates equals more time and money than the market may allow. And given the increase level of liability that a PE has, I err on the side of spending A
LOT of time trying to get these right.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy">My question would be, how much time are you all taking to do one of these 179D models, particularly given whatever potential liability
there is for the PE certifiying the results? How many hours? Isn’t it annoying to have to switch back to 90.1-2001 when all the other modeling (i.e. LEED) use 2004 or 2007 (soon 2010)?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<font size="5" color="navy" face="Copperplate Gothic Bold"><span style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:"Copperplate Gothic Bold";color:navy">Edward M. Allen, PE, CEM</span></font><b><font color="navy" face="Frutiger 65 Bold"><span style="font-family:"Frutiger 65 Bold";color:navy;font-weight:bold"><o:p></o:p></span></font></b></p>
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<b><font size="3" color="navy" face="Frutiger 65 Bold"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Frutiger 65 Bold";color:navy;font-weight:
bold">L</span></font></b><b><font color="green" face="Frutiger 65 Bold"><span style="font-family:"Frutiger 65 Bold";color:green;font-weight:bold">O</span></font></b><b><font color="navy" face="Frutiger 65 Bold"><span style="font-family:"Frutiger 65 Bold";
color:navy;font-weight:bold">NG</span></font></b><font color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-family:Arial;color:navy">
</span></font><b><font size="1" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy;
font-weight:bold">Energy Solutions</span></font></b><font color="black"><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<i><font size="1" color="black" face="Frutiger 65 Bold"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Frutiger 65 Bold";color:black;font-style:
italic">Technology for Better Buildings</span></font></i><font size="1" color="black"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;color:black">
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<font size="1" color="black" face="Arial"><span style="font-size:
8.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black">775.657.9180 office 720.217.1356 mobile 775.657.9180 fax<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<font size="1" color="black" face="Arial"><span style="font-size:
8.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black">eallen@long.com<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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color:navy">
</span></font><font color="navy"><span style="color:navy"><a href="http://www.long.com/" title="http://www.long.com/"><font size="1" face="Arial"><span style="font-size:
8.0pt;font-family:Arial">http://www.long.com</span></font></a></span></font><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="navy" face="Arial"><span style="font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><font size="2" face="Tahoma"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold">From:</span></font></b><font size="2" face="Tahoma"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma"> equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <b><span style="font-weight:
bold">On Behalf Of
</span></b>Michael Hardy<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Sent:</span></b> Wednesday, February 09, 2011 4:46 PM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">To:</span></b> 'eQUEST Users List'<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: [Equest-users] Incentives for NU Modelers and LEED APs</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:
12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Calibri"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D">I would like to weigh in supporting Chris on the increased liability that a PE (and a licensed contractor) carry. Yes, I am
a PE, so it’s probably not surprising that I feel this way. I also won’t disagree with the assertion that having a PE license doesn’t ensure that the engineer is qualified for the work and it doesn’t preclude an engineer from having shoddy business practices.
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Calibri"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Calibri"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D">Anyone who has done very much building simulation at all, or just monitors this listserve, knows that it takes a certain amount
of technical knowledge and time to wade through the innumerable variables, assumptions and bits of data that need to be input in order to perform a decent simulation. Unless the simulation is going to be reviewed in minute detail such as is done with LEED
reviews, there are innumerable places where someone can go wrong either through knowingly trying to maximize or minimize the results, through ignorance, or through shoddy workmanship.
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Calibri"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Calibri"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D">While Paul maintains that I can’t be held liable for a bad energy simulation, that may be the case for a non-PE (I don’t know
how it applies to Licensed Contractors), but it’s definitely not the case for a PE. As part of my state-issued license to practice engineering, I carry a legal responsibility to act in the best interest of the public (whether “the public” is my client or
not) and to conduct all of my work according to the minimum Standard of Care for that type of service. Anyone can file a complaint with the state PE licensing board alleging that my work does not measure up. If the complaint is found to have merit and the
licensing board chooses to pull my license, then I would be out of work since I am self-employed. This is all without ever going to a court and it has nothing to do with whether the energy goals were met or not, only whether the work I did was “good enough”.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Calibri"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Calibri"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D">My take on what NU seems to be looking for, is for someone who has some kind of state-issued license (and therefore legal recourse)
to review and approve the methodology and assumptions that went into the simulation. The various certifications previously mentioned may indicate adequate technical knowledge, but they carry no legal recourse unless they are backed by a license issued by
a government agency.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Calibri"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Calibri"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D">That’s my take anyway.
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Calibri"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="black" face="Arial"><span style="font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black">Michael L. Hardy, PE, F.NSPE</span></font><font size="2" color="#1f497d"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#1F497D">
<br>
</span></font><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Tahoma"><span style="font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:#1F497D">Black Oak Engineering, Inc.</span></font><font color="#1f497d" face="Tahoma"><span style="font-family:Tahoma;color:#1F497D"><br>
</span></font><font size="2" color="black" face="Tahoma"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;color:black">Cell 503.314.5244</span></font><font color="#1f497d"><span style="color:#1F497D">
</span></font><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Calibri"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;
color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><font size="2" face="Tahoma"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold">From:</span></font></b><font size="2" face="Tahoma"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma"> equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <b><span style="font-weight:
bold">On Behalf Of
</span></b>Paul Diglio<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Sent:</span></b> Wednesday, February 09, 2011 1:05 PM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">To:</span></b> Chris Balbach; Nick Caton; Pasha Korber-Gonzalez; eQUEST Users List<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: [Equest-users] Incentives for NU Modelers and LEED APs<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:
12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:
10.0pt">Chris:<br>
<br>
I don't think you get it. There is no way anyone can hold you to the energy savings because a simulation is not intended to accurately forecast a buildings energy usage. A PE can provide a cover letter, charge $2,000 or $3,000 and walk away fat and happy.
I am not saying you would do this, but some PEs will.<br>
<br>
By the way, I also have liability insurance for commissioning, HVAC Contracting and energy auditing. I can provide the calculations for a Section 179D deduction and my license, like yours, is on the line.
<br>
<br>
Paul <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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10.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><font size="2" face="Tahoma"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold">From:</span></font></b><font size="2" face="Tahoma"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma"> Chris
Balbach <cbalbach@psdconsulting.com><br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">To:</span></b> Nick Caton <ncaton@smithboucher.com>; Pasha Korber-Gonzalez <pasha.pkconsulting@gmail.com>; Paul Diglio <paul.diglio@sbcglobal.net>; eQUEST Users List <equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org><br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Sent:</span></b> Wed, February 9, 2011 3:58:09 PM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Subject:</span></b> RE: [Equest-users] Incentives for NU Modelers and LEED APs</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">All;</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Alright - I’ll weigh in on this one… There’s big difference between licensing and certification.
</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">What I mean by that is that there is a big difference (IMHO) between a PE placing his/her stamp on a document and a BEMP, etc. reviewing
and approving the same document. The difference is a level of risk that the PE is assuming when he/she stakes their name and reputation behind something. The engineering profession has, over time, instituted a series of ‘checks and balances’ for ensuring quality
work, for example, there exists a NSPE “Code of Ethics for Engineers” (<a href="http://www.nspe.org/Ethics/CodeofEthics/index.html" target="_blank">http://www.nspe.org/Ethics/CodeofEthics/index.html</a>). There is also licensing board (differs state by state)
who both gives and takes away licenses based on professional misconduct, etc. There are also Boards of Ethics who again, review complaints and can recommend to the state board that a PE lose his/her license based on the situation – far,far more than the “continuing
education” requirements that currently exist for the BEMP or AEE modeling certifications. </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">The Engineering Code of Ethics clearly states:</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="maintext"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">“Engineers shall perform services only in the areas of their competence.”</span></font></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">So, if you feel a PE is practicing outside his/her area of competence, then you have grounds to file a complaint with your state’s licensing
board. It’s been done before. As a practicing PE, I also had better have “Professional Liability” insurance to manage the known and unknown risks associated with practicing in my field of expertise, because people can and will sue me. When I sign, stamp
or seal a document, I am held to a much, much higher standard of performance than a BEMP, or BESA, CMVP, or many of the other certifications that are rapidly forming in the energy services space are currently being held to.
</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">In a nutshell, I think the PE designation is (currently) the only engineering professional designation that has the kind of institutional
Q/A that is necessary to prevent rampant abuse. I would love to see BEMP, BESA or other energy modeler certifications grow to this level, but we must acknowledge the inherent balance of (risk/reward) that comes with professional liability. I see why Northeast
utilities wants to engage a PE, because if they choose to engage in this service, that PE is accepting a level of professional liability if/when things ‘go south’.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">I felt similar about Commissioning Certifications that were the rage a few years ago. The way things were set up, it was the PE, or “design
engineer of record” who assumed professional liability for a design, and the commission professional often had very little professional risk yet the potential for great reward (significant commissioning fees as compared to A/E design fees). I don’t know if
that has changed, but I see the potential for a similar ‘set-up’ with the energy modeling community.
</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Thoughts?</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">All the best,</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">_Chris</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Chris Balbach, PE, CEM, BEMP, CMVP, BESA</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="1" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;color:#1F497D">Vice President of Research and Development</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="1" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;color:#1F497D">Cell: (607)-327-1647</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="1" color="black" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;color:black">124 Brindley Street,
<st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">Ithaca</st1:City>, <st1:State w:st="on">
NY</st1:State> <st1:PostalCode w:st="on">14850</st1:PostalCode></st1:place><br>
<a href="http://www.psdconsulting.com/" target="_blank">www.psdconsulting.com</a></span></font><font color="black"><span style="color:black">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><font size="2" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-weight:bold">From:</span></font></b><font size="2"><span style="font-size:10.0pt"> equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org [mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org]
<b><span style="font-weight:
bold">On Behalf Of </span></b>Nick Caton<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Sent:</span></b> Wednesday, February 09, 2011 1:49 PM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">To:</span></b> Pasha Korber-Gonzalez; Paul Diglio; eQUEST Users List<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: [Equest-users] Incentives for NU Modelers and LEED APs</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:
12.0pt"> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">As neither a PE (yet) nor a BEMP, I can offer some thoughts/suggestions from the sidelines =).</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="msolistparagraph"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">- A BEMP certification is certainly a more applicable qualification than having a PE seal from a model-reviewing standpoint.
That said, there is a much smaller pool of BEMP reviewers out there, and the desire for a certain quality standard in model reviews needs to be weighed against the availability of the “BEMP reviewership” out there.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="msolistparagraph"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">- 179D’s tax deduction precedent, which permits locally licensed contractors in addition to PE’s involved in the work to
produce/certify the calculations, better encompasses the range of commercial work out there on a national level (retrofit upgrades and the like) which may not locally require an Engineer’s seal.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="msolistparagraph"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">- The suggestion that no certification (BEMP or PE) ought to be required of those compiling the incentive documentation is
not a bad idea, provided the utility can manage or sub-contract out the spreadsheet/model/calculation review to those with the desired qualifications… see my next bullet. Any such requirement will likely have some impact on how widely the incentive program
is considered and pursued by building owners.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="msolistparagraph"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">- One of our local utilities has a similar incentive program, but they are much less open about who can certify the model/calculations
submitted. They privately hire out and take on the costs of such review as part of the incentive program’s costs, so while it’s no cost to submit, it’s not up to the contractor/engineers seeking to achieve the incentives to decide who’s doing the reviewing.
Consider that food for thought.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="msolistparagraph"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">- Also concurring this discussion would be better-situated in [bldg-sim], but perhaps this is a wide enough audience based
on the quick responses =).</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.25in"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">I can address the AE PE as I’m studying right now for April: Those considering or studying for the Architectural Engineering (AE) PE exam
will find experience in building energy modeling, and particularly the inter-discipline communication and design experience/understanding that stems from energy modeling, is pretty helpful. Energy modeling experience isolated from building system design experience
probably won’t cut it, however.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">The AE exam is unique to the other PE exams in that:</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="msolistparagraph"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">- Every single question is directly related to the building industry – no questions about the airspeed velocity of an unladen
swallow.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="msolistparagraph"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">- The exam is very much cross-discipline: questions cover mechanical, electrical, plumbing structural design; envelop analysis,
and project management / construction administration</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="msolistparagraph"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">- There are also some inter-disciplinary questions (i.e. how lighting loads can affect cooling capacities and how fenestration
layout/shading affects lighting/HVAC) which require knowledge in more than one area. These questions are a piece of cake for those practiced in energy modeling.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="msolistparagraph"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">- If you practice energy modeling and seek to really understand what you’re doing, you’ll be forced to understand some fundamentals
that the average MEP consultant won’t need to be rock-solid on to do his/her job well, and that may put you at an advantage for the AE PE.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">I would not conclude an AE PE would be any better/worse-qualified than an EE or ME PE for model reviewing however. Having a PE of any sort
is no guarantee of the modeling experience necessary for a quality review.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">~Nick</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"><img border="0" width="119" height="37" id="Picture_x005f_x0020_1" src="cid:image001.jpg@01CBC87A.E6957170" alt="cid:489575314@22072009-0ABB"></span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><font size="2" color="#2d4d5e" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#2D4D5E;font-weight:bold">NICK CATON, E.I.T.</span></font></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="1" color="#cc9900" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:7.5pt;color:#CC9900">PROJECT ENGINEER</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#2d4d5e" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E">Smith & Boucher Engineers</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#2d4d5e" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E">25501 west valley parkway</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on"><font size="2" color="#2d4d5e" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;
color:#2D4D5E">olathe</span></font></st1:place></st1:City><font size="2" color="#2d4d5e"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E">
ks 66061</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#2d4d5e" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E">direct 913 344.0036</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#2d4d5e" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E">fax 913 345.0617</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="#1f497d" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#1F497D">www.smithboucher.com</span></font><u><font size="2" color="blue"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:blue">
</span></font></u><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><font size="2" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-weight:bold">From:</span></font></b><font size="2"><span style="font-size:10.0pt"> equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org [mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org]
<b><span style="font-weight:
bold">On Behalf Of </span></b>Pasha Korber-Gonzalez<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Sent:</span></b> Wednesday, February 09, 2011 10:59 AM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">To:</span></b> Paul Diglio; eQUEST Users List<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: [Equest-users] Incentives for NU Modelers and LEED APs</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:
12.0pt">I too think you are right to do this, and should post on the other bldg-sim, and maybe all the other lists too. This is a HUGE mistake and detriment to all simulators,
and it is an insult to us experienced simulators to dictate that a PE has to review the sims...majority of the PE's I know and work with are not simulators and know very little about simulation, let alone enough to review one properly--which is why I'm getting
hired by them because I know simulation(s). I would sooner trust a non-PE with direct simulation experience over a PE with little sim experience to review my own models...<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:
12.0pt">Also I agree with David, and I will recommend to the contact you provided, that the BEMP certification is a much better measure of true simulation understanding, experience, and
knowledge for review of simulations. I think of the BEMP as the 'PE' for simulators--if someone can achieve the BEMP certification, at this point in time it is a better qualifier for simulation experience and knowledge than a PE would anyday---are there
even any question on building energy simulation on the MECH PE exam? Maybe there are sim questions on the new ARCH ENG PE exam for building designers? Does anyone know?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:
12.0pt">There is likely to be much BIGGER issues with the quality of simulations that woud be submitted if they are being reviewed by inexperienced PE's who are dictating changes
to the model that wouldn't be appropriate based on the software limitations that are so inherent in all of the whole building simulation programs that are on the market currently. It is less likely for a random PE to be aware of these software limitations
than a BEMP.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">Pasha<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="3" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:
12.0pt">On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 8:57 AM, Paul Diglio <<a href="mailto:paul.diglio@sbcglobal.net" target="_blank">paul.diglio@sbcglobal.net</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2" color="black" face="Times New Roman"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:black">I realize that this message might not be appropriate to the forum, but it is the only way I know to contact the other simulators that will be
affected by Northeast Utilities modeling requirements. NU covers CT and <st1:place w:st="on">
Western Massachusetts</st1:place>.<br>
<br>
Some of you might know that NU is offering sizable incentives for modeling, improvements over ASHRAE 90.1 and LEED certification.<br>
<br>
The program is new for 2011 and NU just made the decision that the model has to be review and approved by a PE, any PE. Even if LEED approves your application, it still needs to be vetted by a PE to qualify for an incentive.<br>
<br>
If you are unhappy with this decision and find it is discriminatory, please e-mail James Motta
<a href="mailto:mottaj@NU.com" target="_blank">mottaj@NU.com</a>.<br>
<br>
Thank you,<br>
<br>
Paul Diglio</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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