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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>As neither a PE (yet) nor a BEMP, I can offer some thoughts/suggestions
from the sidelines =).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>-<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>A BEMP certification is certainly a more applicable
qualification than having a PE seal from a model-reviewing standpoint.
That said, there is a much smaller pool of BEMP reviewers out there, and the
desire for a certain quality standard in model reviews needs to be weighed
against the availability of the “BEMP reviewership” out there.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>-<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>179D’s tax deduction precedent, which permits locally
licensed contractors in addition to PE’s involved in the work to
produce/certify the calculations, better encompasses the range of commercial work
out there on a national level (retrofit upgrades and the like) which may not locally
require an Engineer’s seal.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>-<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>The suggestion that no certification (BEMP or PE) ought to be
required of those compiling the incentive documentation is not a bad idea,
provided the utility can manage or sub-contract out the spreadsheet/model/calculation
review to those with the desired qualifications… see my next bullet.
Any such requirement will likely have some impact on how widely the incentive
program is considered and pursued by building owners.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>-<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>One of our local utilities has a similar incentive program, but
they are much less open about who can certify the model/calculations
submitted. They privately hire out and take on the costs of such review
as part of the incentive program’s costs, so while it’s no cost to
submit, it’s not up to the contractor/engineers seeking to achieve the
incentives to decide who’s doing the reviewing. Consider that food
for thought.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>-<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Also concurring this discussion would be better-situated in [bldg-sim],
but perhaps this is a wide enough audience based on the quick responses =).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.25in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I can address the AE PE as I’m studying right now for
April: Those considering or studying for the Architectural Engineering
(AE) PE exam will find experience in building energy modeling, and particularly
the inter-discipline communication and design experience/understanding that stems
from energy modeling, is pretty helpful. Energy modeling experience isolated
from building system design experience probably won’t cut it, however.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>The AE exam is unique to the other PE exams in that:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>-<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Every single question is directly related to the building
industry – no questions about the airspeed velocity of an unladen swallow.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>-<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>The exam is very much cross-discipline: questions cover mechanical,
electrical, plumbing structural design; envelop analysis, and project
management / construction administration<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>-<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>There are also some inter-disciplinary questions (i.e. how
lighting loads can affect cooling capacities and how fenestration
layout/shading affects lighting/HVAC) which require knowledge in more than one
area. These questions are a piece of cake for those practiced in energy
modeling.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>-<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>If you practice energy modeling and seek to really understand what
you’re doing, you’ll be forced to understand some fundamentals that
the average MEP consultant won’t need to be rock-solid on to do his/her
job well, and that may put you at an advantage for the AE PE.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I would not conclude an AE PE would be any better/worse-qualified
than an EE or ME PE for model reviewing however. Having a PE of any sort
is no guarantee of the modeling experience necessary for a quality review.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>~Nick<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><img width=119 height=37 id="Picture_x0020_1"
src="cid:image001.jpg@01CBC851.F9C45190" alt="cid:489575314@22072009-0ABB"></span><b><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Stylus BT","sans-serif";color:#2D4D5E'><o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Stylus BT","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Stylus BT","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E'>NICK CATON, E.I.T.</span></b><b><span style='font-family:"Stylus BT","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E'><o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#CC9900'>PROJECT ENGINEER<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E'>Smith & Boucher Engineers</span><span style='font-size:7.5pt;
color:#CC9900'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E'>25501 west valley parkway<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E'>olathe ks 66061<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E'>direct 913 344.0036<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E'>fax 913 345.0617<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><a href="www.smithboucher.com"
title="blocked::www.smithboucher.com"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>www.smithboucher.com</span></a></span><u><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:blue'> </span></u><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>
equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Pasha
Korber-Gonzalez<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, February 09, 2011 10:59 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Paul Diglio; eQUEST Users List<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] Incentives for NU Modelers and LEED APs<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<div>
<p class=MsoNormal>I too think you are right to do this, and should post
on the other bldg-sim, and maybe all the other lists too. This is a
HUGE mistake and detriment to all simulators, and it is an insult to us
experienced simulators to dictate that a PE has to review the sims...majority
of the PE's I know and work with are not simulators and
know very little about simulation, let alone enough to review one
properly--which is why I'm getting hired by them because I know
simulation(s). I would sooner trust a non-PE with direct simulation
experience over a PE with little sim experience to review my own models...<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal>Also I agree with David, and I will recommend to the
contact you provided, that the BEMP certification is a much better measure of
true simulation understanding, experience, and knowledge for review of
simulations. I think of the BEMP as the 'PE' for simulators--if
someone can achieve the BEMP certification, at this point in time it is a
better qualifier for simulation experience and knowledge than a PE would
anyday---are there even any question on building energy simulation on the MECH
PE exam? Maybe there are sim questions on the new ARCH ENG PE exam
for building designers? Does anyone know?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal>There is likely to be much BIGGER issues with the
quality of simulations that woud be submitted if they are being reviewed by
inexperienced PE's who are dictating changes to the model that wouldn't be
appropriate based on the software limitations that are so inherent in all of
the whole building simulation programs that are on the market currently.
It is less likely for a random PE to be aware of these software limitations
than a BEMP.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Pasha<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal>On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 8:57 AM, Paul Diglio <<a
href="mailto:paul.diglio@sbcglobal.net">paul.diglio@sbcglobal.net</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>I realize that
this message might not be appropriate to the forum, but it is the only way I
know to contact the other simulators that will be affected by Northeast
Utilities modeling requirements. NU covers CT and Western Massachusetts.<br>
<br>
Some of you might know that NU is offering sizable incentives for modeling,
improvements over ASHRAE 90.1 and LEED certification.<br>
<br>
The program is new for 2011 and NU just made the decision that the model has to
be review and approved by a PE, any PE. Even if LEED approves your
application, it still needs to be vetted by a PE to qualify for an incentive.<br>
<br>
If you are unhappy with this decision and find it is discriminatory, please
e-mail James Motta mottaj@NU.com.<br>
<br>
Thank you,<br>
<br>
Paul Diglio<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>
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<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
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