<html><head><style type="text/css"><!-- DIV {margin:0px;} --></style></head><body><div style="font-family:times new roman,new york,times,serif;font-size:10pt">I would not be concerned that there is a disadvantage to sub-meters because using separate meters removes the internal loads from the HVAC system.<br><br>In the Northeast, the elevator equipment rooms are generally exhausted with maybe a unit heater for use during very cold weather. Kitchens use makeup air and hood exhaust so the cooking equipment load does not trespass into the building. Besides kitchens are seldom air-conditioned and the heating load is minimal.<br><br>Paul Diglio<br><div><br></div><div style="font-family: times new roman,new york,times,serif; font-size: 10pt;"><br><div style="font-family: times new roman,new york,times,serif; font-size: 12pt;"><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><hr size="1"><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">From:</span></b> Nick Caton
<ncaton@smithboucher.com><br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> "Bosch, Crina" <CBosch@karpinskieng.com>; Ravi Srinivasan <ravi.s.srinivasan@gmail.com><br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Cc:</span></b> equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Mon, January 24, 2011 4:37:50 PM<br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: [Equest-users] Cooking Equipment and Elevators/ Exhaust fans<br></font><br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">The comment from the reviewer looks like a copy-paste job from one
of my recent models (maybe we got the same guy/gal?).</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Applying the equipment loads to the spaces as you’ve initially
done is the intuitive thing to do, but for LEED you will run into issues coming
up with annual consumption totals and maximum demand figures analogous to other
energy enduses normally reported in the graphical outputs.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">As others are suggesting, I have specified non-receptacle
process loads as direct loads to one or more submeters. In doing so you
can get the analogous monthly consumption/demand quantities reported explicitly
through report PS-B, separate from your default gas/electric meters.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">The disadvantage here (to the potential detriment in your
modeled performance) is that this method of reporting separately also removes
the associated internal loads from your buildings, which means you gain less
credit for any better-than-standard HVAC equipment handling those loads.
In the case of elevators, it may be negligible, but in the case of significant kitchen
equipment loads, you might want to run it defined each ways [submetered for PS-B
documentation but in the spaces for everything else] and explain the reason for
the separate simulation in the provided PS-B reports is because the loads must
be “isolated” from the building to meet such reporting demands, but
that this in turn skews the loads incident on the systems for the actual model
performance runs… </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">…but don’t jump through any extra hoops if removing
those internal loads doesn’t make a big difference ;)! </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">In fact, Otto’s suggestion to politely advise the reviewer
of the issue and simply provide screenshots of the corresponding schedules/inputs
is interesting and something I might try myself, next time this particular
comment comes up – that may be the path of least resistance.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">~Nick</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><img id="Picture_x0020_1" src="cid:1.2667183280@web83303.mail.sp1.yahoo.com" alt="cid:489575314@22072009-0ABB" width="119" height="37"></span><b><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(45, 77, 94);"></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(45, 77, 94);"> </span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(45, 77, 94);">NICK CATON, E.I.T.</span></b><b><span style="font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(45, 77, 94);"></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 7.5pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(204, 153, 0);">PROJECT ENGINEER</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(45, 77, 94);">Smith & Boucher Engineers</span><span style="font-size: 7.5pt; color: rgb(204, 153, 0);"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(45, 77, 94);">25501 west valley parkway</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(45, 77, 94);">olathe ks 66061</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(45, 77, 94);">direct 913 344.0036</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(45, 77, 94);">fax 913 345.0617</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><a rel="nofollow" title="blocked::www.smithboucher.com"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">www.smithboucher.com</span></a></span><u><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: blue;"> </span></u><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "sans-serif";">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "sans-serif";">
equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Bosch,
Crina<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, January 24, 2011 2:37 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Ravi Srinivasan<br>
<b>Cc:</b> equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] Cooking Equipment and Elevators/ Exhaust
fans</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: navy;">Thank you all for your suggestions and thoughts. I will try the
option with 2 meters and hopefully this will resolve my problem. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: navy;"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: navy;">Sincerely, </span></p>
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<p style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "sans-serif"; color: navy;">Crina Bosch</span><span style="color: navy;"></span></p>
<p><span style="color: navy;"> </span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "sans-serif";">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "sans-serif";"> Ravi Srinivasan
[mailto:ravi.s.srinivasan@gmail.com] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, January 24, 2011 3:35 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Demba Ndiaye; Bosch, Crina<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] Cooking Equipment and Elevators/ Exhaust
fans</span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;">Well said, Demba.<br>
<br>
Crina, create two new meters (of "building" type) - one for Kitchen and
another for Elevator. Input kW and associated schedules as direct loads.<br>
Open the "utility" electricity meter (typically "EM1").
And, bring these two newly created meters within EM1. <br>
<br>
PS-B report should show energy use of Kitchen and Elevator separately. Ensure
you have these two meters and associated loads input in baseline and proposed. <br>
<br>
Best Regards.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
-- <br>
Ravi Srinivasan, PhD</p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Mon, Jan 24, 2011 at 3:15 PM, Demba Ndiaye <<a rel="nofollow" ymailto="mailto:Demba.Ndiaye@setty.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:Demba.Ndiaye@setty.com">Demba.Ndiaye@setty.com</a>> wrote:</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Crina,</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">For the elevators, you can create a
separate meter…</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">_______________</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Demba NDIAYE</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><b><span style="font-size: 10pt;">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> <a rel="nofollow" ymailto="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>
[mailto:<a rel="nofollow" ymailto="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of
</b>Otto Schwieterman<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, January 24, 2011 3:05 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Bosch, Crina; <a rel="nofollow" ymailto="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] Cooking Equipment and Elevators/ Exhaust
fans</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">My only suggestion would be to perform a
save-as and change the misc equipment energy consumption to zero for the
elevator (and then do it again for the kitchen) to find the equipment usage and
demand.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">If your independent fans are exhaust
fans, I would do the same thing that I mentioned above. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">The reports in eQUEST will not break out
the equipment but you can write a narrative explaining that eQUEST cannot
separate these loads and explain your procedure. I believe that the reviewer
simply wants to make sure that the energy consumption is the same for these
items in the baseline and proposed model.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span></p>
<div>
<div style="border-width: 1pt medium medium; border-style: solid none none; border-color: windowtext -moz-use-text-color -moz-use-text-color; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;">
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><b><span style="font-size: 10pt;">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> Bosch,
Crina [mailto:<a rel="nofollow" ymailto="mailto:CBosch@karpinskieng.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:CBosch@karpinskieng.com">CBosch@karpinskieng.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, January 24, 2011 2:04 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a rel="nofollow" ymailto="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Equest-users] Cooking Equipment and Elevators/ Exhaust fans</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;" lang="RO">Dear users, </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;" lang="RO"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;" lang="RO">I received form USGBC the following comment: </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;" lang="RO"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;">“The project contains elevators and kitchen
equipment in the actual design; however, the process energy related to the
elevator and kitchen equipment was not included in each energy model, since
Section 1.8 of the template does not include the process energy consumption for
elevator or kitchen equipment. Revise the Proposed and Baseline models to
include the process energy for elevator and kitchen equipment in the
appropriate space in the models. In addition, update the template reflecting
the changes.”</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;">The kitchen equipment and elevators were input in the
model under the equipment tab for each space as designed but I couldn’t
separate them in eQuest from the Misc. Equip under the Consumption by Enduse
Report or Demand Report. I verified everything I could and see how I can spit
them and the only thing I found was this: “<b>INTERIOR-EU - Accepts a
list of up to 10 code-words specifying the end-use category of the
INTERIOR-POWER. The code-words correspond to the end-use categories in the
end-use reports (PS-E, PS-F, BEPS, BEPU). Acceptable entries are LIGHTS,
TASK-LIGHTS, MISC-EQUIP, SPACE-HEATING, SPACE-COOLING, HEAT-REJECT,
PUMPS&AUX, VENT-FANS, REFRIG-DISPLAY, HT-PUMP-SUPPLEM, DOMEST-HOT-WTR, and
EXT-USAGE.</b> “</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;">In the end I understand that eQuest does not have the
option of doing what the reviewer is asking for. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;">The reviewer also wants the independent fans to be
separated from the supply and return fans which I didn’t find how. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;"><br>
Am I missing something here? </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Your help is appreciated. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Thank you.</span></p>
<div>
<p style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Crina Bosch</span></p>
<p> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span lang="RO"> </span></p>
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