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    <font face="Calibri">Hi Matt,<br>
      That's the same approach we take.  Then I double check to make
      sure the airflow rates in the HVAC summary report in eQuest match
      what the actual rates are. <br>
      <br>
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      <b><font color="#000000"><small>Aleka Pappas</small></font></b><br>
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                    <div class="moz-signature"><font face="Calibri"><b><span
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    <br>
    On 1/20/2011 5:55 PM, <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:MattDubrovich@Eaton.com">MattDubrovich@Eaton.com</a> wrote:
    <blockquote
cite="mid:14A3297B77C0E84ABD35ABA66C32EF42032D8BD6@CLEOHSMB10.napa.ad.etn.com"
      type="cite">
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          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
              font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">Unfortunately
I
              think it might be more complicated than that; I wish it
              wasn’t.  I
              have an old printout of an eQuest/DOE2 document called
              “Sizing Air-Side
              HVAC Systems” which steps through the calculation.  I
              haven’t
              been able to figure out where I printed it from (help
              file?, dictionary? engineers
              manual?).  <o:p></o:p></span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
              font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
              font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">My
              take is that eQuest sizes coils based on sea level
              airflow.  At the end of
              the calculation it simply multiples the needed sea level
              airflow by the
              altitude factor to account for altitude effects.  Per
              Carol’s email,
              eQuest assumes any user entered flows are at sea level. 
              This is
              frustrating because plans usually show airflows at site
              altitude, not sea
              level.  We’ve tried Nick’s work-around which is to change
              the
              altitude to 0 and enter airflows per the drawings.  This
              works on the
              airflow side but not the coil side.  The coils are sized
              using the entered
              airflow x 1.08 so eQuest creates coils that are larger
              than what you actually
              have.  <o:p></o:p></span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
              font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
              font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">What
seems
              to be more correct is to keep the altitude specified and
              divide every
              airflow you enter into the model by the altitude factor. 
              If you’re
              in Denver and want to model a 10,000 CFM fan, enter
              10,000/1.21 into the supply
              CFM input.  eQuest takes that number and multiplies it by
              1.21. 
              Every input with a “CFM” must be adjusted including
              exhaust, CFM/SF,
              etc.  <o:p></o:p></span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
              font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 10pt;
                font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";
                color: black;" lang="EN-GB">Matt Dubrovich, PE, CEM,
                BEMP <br>
              </span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
              "Arial","sans-serif"; color: black;"
              lang="EN-GB">Energy Solutions Group</span><span
              style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
              "Arial","sans-serif"; color: black;"><br>
              <br>
            </span><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
              "Arial","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31,
              73, 125);"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 10pt;
              font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
          <div style="border-right: medium none; border-width: 1pt
            medium medium; border-style: solid none none; border-color:
            rgb(181, 196, 223) -moz-use-text-color -moz-use-text-color;
            padding: 3pt 0in 0in;">
            <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size: 10pt;
                  font-family:
                  "Tahoma","sans-serif";">From:</span></b><span
                style="font-size: 10pt; font-family:
                "Tahoma","sans-serif";">
                <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>
                [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org">mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>] <b>On
                  Behalf Of </b>Carol
                Gardner<br>
                <b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 20, 2011 1:22 PM<br>
                <b>To:</b> Nick Caton<br>
                <b>Cc:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a>; Kendra
                Tupper<br>
                <b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] Does eQUEST derate
                equipment for altitude?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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          <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
          <div style="margin-left: 0.5in;">
            <p class="MsoBodyText"><span style="font-family:
                "Courier New";">Nick/Kendra,</span><span
                style="font-family: "Tms
                Rmn","serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
            <p class="MsoBodyText"><span style="font-family:
                "Courier New";">The altitude
                factor effects the supply air and the outside air. The
                write up below suggests
                that one calculate both supply and outside air at sea
                level and then apply the
                altitude factor to it. In real life, however, the design
                engineer is
                calculating and specifying supply and outside air cfm
                that is already adjusted
                for the altitude and the altitude factor should simply
                be set at 1.0 in eQUEST.</span><span style="font-family:
                "Tms Rmn","serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
            <p class="MsoBodyText"><span style="font-family:
                "Courier New";">The excerpts below
                discuss the areas of eQUEST impacted by the altitude
                factor:</span><span style="font-family: "Tms
                Rmn","serif";"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
            <p class="MsoBodyText"><span style="font-family:
                "Courier New";">N</span><span
                style="font-family: "Tms
                Rmn","serif";">ote: the quantities in
                this report (SV-A)
                have been adjusted for <span style="color: white;
                  background: none repeat scroll 0% 0% rgb(49, 106,
                  197);">altitude</span>
                even though DOE-2 requires that any flows you enter in
                SYSTEMS be at sea level.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family: "Tms
                Rmn","serif";">1.   
              </span>SUPPLY FLOW<br>
              is the calculated or user-specified supply flow for each
              zone.  Only if
              you have specified a value for the ASSIGNED-FLOW keyword
              in the ZONE command
              will the value here correspond to your input. The ZONE
              keywords AIR-CHANGES/HR
              and FLOW/AREA will be accepted by SYSTEMS only if they are
              consistent with the
              user-supplied HEATING-CAPACITY and COOLING-CAPACITY and
              are equivalent to a
              flow larger than that of the exhaust from or the
              ventilation to the zone. The <span style="color: white;
                background: none repeat scroll 0% 0% rgb(49, 106, 197);">ALTITUDE
                FACTOR</span> will be applied.<o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
          <p class="MsoListNumber" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><span
              style="font-family: "Tms
              Rmn","serif";">5.   
            </span>OUTSIDE AIR FLOW<br>
            reflects the user-specified outside air quantity entered at
            the zone
            level.  If OUTSIDE-AIR-FLOW is specified, its value is
            multiplied by the <span style="color: white; background:
              none repeat scroll 0% 0% rgb(49, 106, 197);">ALTITUDE
              FACTOR</span> and reported
            here.  Otherwise the reported value is the maximum of the
            flow-equivalent
            values of OA-CHANGES and OA-FLOW/PER, multiplied by <span
              style="color: white; background: none repeat scroll 0% 0%
              rgb(49, 106, 197);">ALTITUDE FACTOR</span>.  For the
            actual amount of
            outside air delivered to the zone for central systems, see
            OUTSIDE AIR RATIO
            above.<o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><o:p> </o:p></p>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal">On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 10:49 AM, Nick
              Caton <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                href="mailto:ncaton@smithboucher.com">ncaton@smithboucher.com</a>>
              wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
            <div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Kenda,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I’m curious as to
                    whether you
                    received any responses to the query below.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I have incorporated
                    a practice of
                    manually setting the site altitude in my eQuest
                    models to “0,”
                    because (1) as designers we do not specify equipment
                    with CFM’s at sea
                    level, it is already “corrected” for altitude in
                    this sense, and
                    (2) those who review models tend to miss the
                    significance of the altitude
                    factor in the SV-A reports and complain of
                    incorrectly entered airflow rates.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I don’t know if this
                    constitutes a
                    “best practice,” but I know it is common to a number
                    of the regular
                    contributors to these lists besides myself.  As it
                    stands, current
                    standards (90.1-2007) don’t have us “de-rate” or
                    otherwise
                    adjust required minimum SEER/EER values for
                    altitude… so inversely it
                    seem appropriate to remove the altitude variable
                    when modeling for a
                    performance rating… thoughts?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">~Nick</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><img
                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                      alt="cid:489575314@22072009-0ABB"
                      id="_x0000_i1025"
src="https://mail.google.com/mail/html/compose/static_files/blank_quirks.html?ui=2&ik=367e06555b&view=att&th=12da4c2bcd697d9b&attid=0.0.1&disp=emb&zw"
                      border="0" height="37" width="119"></span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><b><span style="font-size:
                      11pt; color: rgb(45, 77, 94);"> </span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><b><span style="font-size:
                      11pt; color: rgb(45, 77, 94);">NICK CATON, E.I.T.</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    7.5pt; color: rgb(204, 153, 0);">PROJECT ENGINEER</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    10pt; color: rgb(45, 77, 94);">Smith & Boucher
                    Engineers</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    10pt; color: rgb(45, 77, 94);">25501 west valley
                    parkway</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    10pt; color: rgb(45, 77, 94);">olathe ks 66061</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    10pt; color: rgb(45, 77, 94);">direct 913 344.0036</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    10pt; color: rgb(45, 77, 94);">fax 913 345.0617</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><a
                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                      href="http://www.smithboucher.com/"
                      target="_blank"
                      title="blocked::www.smithboucher.com"><span
                        style="font-size: 10pt;">www.smithboucher.com</span></a></span><u><span
                      style="font-size: 10pt; color: blue;"> </span></u><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:
                    11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                <div style="border-right: medium none; border-width: 1pt
                  medium medium; border-style: solid none none;
                  border-color: rgb(181, 196, 223) -moz-use-text-color
                  -moz-use-text-color; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;">
                  <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><b><span
                        style="font-size: 10pt;">From:</span></b><span
                      style="font-size: 10pt;"> <a
                        moz-do-not-send="true"
                        href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org"
                        target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>
                      [mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                        href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org"
                        target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>]
                      <b>On Behalf Of
                      </b>Kendra Tupper<br>
                      <b>Sent:</b> Thursday, September 02, 2010 1:53 PM<br>
                      <b>To:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                        href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org"
                        target="_blank">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
                      <b>Subject:</b> [Equest-users] Does eQUEST derate
                      equipment for altitude?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                </div>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style=""> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="">All,<o:p></o:p></p>
                <div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal" style=""> <o:p></o:p></p>
                </div>
                <div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal" style="">I'm
                    trying to get clarification on exactly how eQUEST
                    handles the altitude above
                    sea level that is entered in Site Parameters. My
                    understanding is this affects
                    the airflow sizing calculations for cfm, but does
                    not change the hourly air
                    density for all calculations. If that is correct,
                    then the altitude only
                    corrects the cfms at the zone and system level, but
                    does not derate equipment
                    efficiencies. So, if you were to enter the altitude
                    above sea level, you should
                    then enter your airflows at sea level, but enter all
                    equipment efficiencies at the derated conditions for
                    that altitude.<o:p></o:p></p>
                </div>
                <div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal" style=""> <o:p></o:p></p>
                </div>
                <div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal" style="">Is
                    that correct?<o:p></o:p></p>
                </div>
                <div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal" style=""> <o:p></o:p></p>
                </div>
                <div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal" style="">Kendra
                    Tupper, PE, LEED AP<br>
                    Senior Consultant<br>
                    Built Environment Team<br>
                    <br>
                    Rocky Mountain Institute  |  T  303-567-8641 |  F 
                    303-245-7213  |  <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                      href="http://www.rmi.org/" target="_blank">www.rmi.org</a><o:p></o:p></p>
                </div>
              </div>
            </div>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><br>
              _______________________________________________<br>
              Equest-users mailing list<br>
              <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/equest-users-onebuilding.org"
                target="_blank">http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/equest-users-onebuilding.org</a><br>
              To unsubscribe from this mailing list send  a blank
              message to <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                href="mailto:EQUEST-USERS-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG">EQUEST-USERS-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG</a><o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><br>
            <br clear="all">
            <br>
            -- <br>
            Carol Gardner PE<o:p></o:p></p>
        </div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
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