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<title>RE: [Equest-users] Modifying Geometry</title>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>What I usually do when I need to modify geometry is I save a
version of the file and call it “old”, then I open that file and
the file I am working on at the same time. You can use the old file to check
what vertices and walls you had for the space after you delete it in your new
file. I think in your case, I probably would have left the space as it was and
then added a space within it. you’d have a big space, then one inside of
it. I’d then adjust the wall lengths and square footage of the big space
so it didn’t overlap the other space anymore.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>You’re biggest problem will be when other spaces
reference your old space as a “next to.” When you go into the
properties of a wall, you’ll see the wall is sometimes located by what it
is “next to”. when you move the old space, you’re other
spaces around it might get confused. Go into the spaces immediately surrounding
the space you’re adjusting and make sure you put in the newly created
room as the “next to” instead of leaving the old room there.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>When you edit a 2-d view, you can type in the location of
the vertices instead of dragging the dots around and trying to get close. Use your
old file as a reference for these vertices. The corners (vertices) of the two
spaces should not be different than your old corners. Does this help?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Omar Katanani<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Wednesday, July 21, 2010
2:43 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [Equest-users]
Modifying Geometry</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Wow, I didn't know I would cause all this debate!!<br>
<br>
Anyways, I modified a zone that I want to split into 2 non-identical zones.
Then I had a hole in my building.<br>
I created a new space and a new polygon. I fitted the polygon into the empty
hole as seen in "2D Polygon.jpg".<br>
<br>
Then after I returned to the 2D view mode, I discovered that the space is not
located properly!! It's 9:45PM and I'm still at the office! This modeling thing
is frustrating!<br>
<br>
I also attach the eQUEST files, if someone can please help. If someone was very
kind to clearly help me sort this zone out, I think I can continue the
rest of the building zones modifications in peace!<br>
<br>
Many thanks!<br>
Omar<br>
<br>
___________________________<br>
<br>
Omar Katanani<br>
Sustainable Design Engineer<br>
Email: omar@ecoconsulting.net<br>
<br>
<br>
EcoConsulting (<st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Lebanon</st1:place></st1:country-region>)<br>
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Ltd<br>
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Website: www.ecoconsulting.net<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org on behalf of tim<br>
Sent: Wed 7/21/2010 9:18 PM<br>
To: 'Bishop, Bill'<br>
Cc: equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Modifying Geometry<br>
<br>
Wow Bill - that is cool - thanks for that. Not sure I will be that adept<br>
after my 7000 square foot project, but it's good to know the capabilities.<br>
This building was generated in equest? I did find where you can change
the<br>
pitch of the roof by degrees! <br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
I have never use revit with equest btw - I was just reacting bitterly to my<br>
first go at trying to use that interface. I tried to customize zones and<br>
came up with some crazy thing that looked like a tree house for monkeys.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Thanks for helping me believe.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Tim<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
From: Bishop, Bill [<a href="mailto:wbishop@pathfinder-ea.com">mailto:wbishop@pathfinder-ea.com</a>]<br>
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 2:00 PM<br>
To: tim<br>
Cc: equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
Subject: RE: [Equest-users] Modifying Geometry<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Tim,<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Yes, you can do complex roofs if you work at it and nobody reminds you that<br>
you're working on a deadline. (See attached.) Ditto Carol's Revit comment<br>
and Lan's simpler-is-better-to-a-point advice.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Regards,<br>
<br>
Bill<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">William</st1:City> <st1:State w:st="on">Bishop</st1:State>,
<st1:State w:st="on">PE</st1:State></st1:place>, BEMP, LEEDR AP | Pathfinder
Engineers & Architects LLP<br>
<br>
Mechanical Engineer<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<st1:Street w:st="on"><st1:address w:st="on">134 South Fitzhugh Street</st1:address></st1:Street><br>
<st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">Rochester</st1:City>, <st1:State
w:st="on">NY</st1:State> <st1:PostalCode w:st="on">14608</st1:PostalCode></st1:place><br>
T: (585) 325-6004 Ext. 114<br>
F: (585) 325-6005<br>
<br>
wbishop@pathfinder-ea.com<br>
<br>
www.pathfinder-ea.com<br>
<br>
P Sustainability - less is more.<br>
<br>
_____ <br>
<br>
From: equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
[<a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org">mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>]
On Behalf Of Li, Lan<br>
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 1:42 PM<br>
To: tim; Carol Gardner<br>
Cc: equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Modifying Geometry<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Tim,<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
I think eQuest is an energy modeling program and we are more concerned in<br>
BTU/ton terms - or $$ at the end. If the roof was built somewhat differently<br>
by modeler as it was shown on architectural drawings, my question is only<br>
how much it will affect the energy usage. If it is a minor, I won't drive<br>
myself crazy to make them same. If you read Ashare 90-1, simplify
building<br>
geometry for energy simulation purpose is allowed. Also when we model a<br>
building, we can have tons of inputs and lots of assumptions are made either<br>
by us or by the program itself, I think majority of them can have a bigger<br>
impact on our goal than build a prefect roof/building shell. I might be one<br>
of the lazy modelers. Hope you can enjoy eQuest a little bit more.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Thanks!<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Lan<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Lan Li, PE<br>
<br>
Mechanical Engineer<br>
<br>
Scheeser Buckley Mayfield LLC <br>
<br>
1540 Corporate <st1:Street w:st="on"><st1:address w:st="on">Woods Parkway</st1:address></st1:Street><br>
<br>
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w:st="on">OH</st1:State> <st1:PostalCode w:st="on">44685</st1:PostalCode></st1:place><br>
<br>
Phone: (330) 896-4664 ext. 123<br>
<br>
Cell: (330) 904-6292<br>
<br>
Fax: (330) 896-9180<br>
<br>
<<a href="mailto:lli@sbmce.com">mailto:lli@sbmce.com</a>>
lli@sbmce.com<br>
<br>
www.sbmce.com <<a href="http://www.sbmce.com/">http://www.sbmce.com/</a>><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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Office (614) 448-1498<br>
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_____ <br>
<br>
From: tim [<a href="mailto:tim.jgrier@fuse.net">mailto:tim.jgrier@fuse.net</a>]<br>
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 1:29 PM<br>
To: 'Carol Gardner'<br>
Cc: equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Modifying Geometry<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
If you're complimenting me on my observation, my awareness must be at an<br>
all-time high today.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
How about a complex roof shape like the one attached? Notice ridge lines<br>
don't match and there is a gable at the porch end as well as the building<br>
end.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Can equest do that too? As long as one would put in the training time of<br>
course.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Tim<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
From: Carol Gardner [<a href="mailto:cmg750@gmail.com">mailto:cmg750@gmail.com</a>]<br>
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 1:01 PM<br>
To: tim<br>
Cc: Omar Katanani; equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Modifying Geometry<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Well, at least your powers of observation aren't suffering.<br>
<br>
Yes, you can model individual ceiling heights per room. You can do almost<br>
anything once you take the time to learn how. What are the specifics of what<br>
you want to do: model a room with two different ceiling heights or model a<br>
bunch of rooms with one height and a bunch with another height? A picture<br>
would be great if ya have one.<br>
<br>
On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 9:56 AM, tim <tim.jgrier@fuse.net> wrote:<br>
<br>
Wow - I think I struck a nerve.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On a related note.<br>
<br>
Does equest have a way to model individual ceiling heights per room?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Thanks,<br>
<br>
Tim<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
From: Carol Gardner [<a href="mailto:cmg750@gmail.com">mailto:cmg750@gmail.com</a>]<br>
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 12:43 PM<br>
To: tim<br>
Cc: Omar Katanani; equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<br>
<br>
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Modifying Geometry<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
I have got to protest this one, sorry Tim.<br>
<br>
<br>
Buying a Revit license to be able to accurately model geometry in eQUEST is,<br>
to be blunt, crazy. It's really pretty easy to revise your geometry and if<br>
you can't do that using one of the 3 methods I provided earlier, you need to<br>
figure out how to train yourself better or leave the field. It's not just a<br>
matter of being able to use eQUEST at this point, it's a matter of being<br>
able to generate an accurate model using any tool. Being able to import CAD<br>
or Revit data into energy models is a recent development. Frankly, I<br>
question it's utility, especially if people now think they have to use it or<br>
they can't model a building. Friendly front ends like eQUEST, DesignBuilder,<br>
etc., are great but you need to know how a building operates and how the<br>
systems work or it's just GIGO.<br>
<br>
Carol<br>
<br>
On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 9:29 AM, tim <tim.jgrier@fuse.net> wrote:<br>
<br>
Omar<br>
<br>
I haven't had much luck with customizing spaces either. <br>
<br>
I think there is a way to import a revit model file into equest. If I<br>
needed complicated zones & spatial geometry, I would probably consider a<br>
revit license, but with that come's more money ($4-$6k for 1 standalone<br>
license) and possibly more training, but might save a whole lot of headache.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Seems like equest is more of an energy modeler than an accurate building<br>
modeler.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
tim <br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
From: equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
[<a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org">mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>]
On Behalf Of Omar<br>
Katanani<br>
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 10:46 AM<br>
To: equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
Subject: [Equest-users] Modifying Geometry<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Dear all,<br>
<br>
Once again, another problem!<br>
<br>
I have several spaces which were geometrically modified in the design. For<br>
example, a room that was split into two different ones; with each room being<br>
a different hvac zone. How can I possibly split a room into two zones
"1"<br>
and "2"? Shall I modify the geometry of the old zone to be that of
zone "1",<br>
and then add another zone "2" from scratch? If this is what should be
done,<br>
how can I do this accurately?<br>
<br>
Attached is the polygon view of one of my floors. When you look at them in<br>
2-D or 3-D views, the building seems perfect in shape. Notice the rectangle<br>
to the left of the picture! This is actually a zone that lies inside the<br>
building. But it appears like this in polygon view. I think it is some<br>
problem of coordinate references or so!<br>
So when I need to modify the geometry according to coordinates of vertices,<br>
I'm suffering!<br>
<br>
Many thanks!<br>
Omar<br>
<br>
___________________________<br>
<br>
Omar Katanani<br>
Sustainable Design Engineer<br>
Email: omar@ecoconsulting.net<br>
<br>
<br>
EcoConsulting (<st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Lebanon</st1:place></st1:country-region>)<br>
<st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Nahas</st1:PlaceName> <st1:PlaceType
w:st="on">Building</st1:PlaceType></st1:place>, 4th floor<br>
<st1:Street w:st="on"><st1:address w:st="on">4 St-Maron Street</st1:address></st1:Street>
/ <st1:Street w:st="on"><st1:address w:st="on">Georges Haddad Avenue</st1:address></st1:Street><br>
Postal Code: 2028 5806 SAIFI<br>
<st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">Beirut</st1:City>, <st1:country-region
w:st="on">Lebanon</st1:country-region></st1:place><br>
Tel: +961 (0) 1 971 255<br>
<st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Mobile</st1:place></st1:City>:
+961 (0) 3 045 045<br>
<br>
<br>
EcoConsulting (<st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">UK</st1:place></st1:country-region>)
Ltd<br>
<st1:Street w:st="on"><st1:address w:st="on">28 Marshalsea Road</st1:address></st1:Street><br>
<st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">London</st1:City>, <st1:PostalCode
w:st="on">SE1 1HF</st1:PostalCode></st1:place><br>
Tel: +44 (0)207 939 0989<br>
Fax: +44 (0)207 939 0981<br>
Website: www.ecoconsulting.net<br>
<br>
<br>
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--<br>
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<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
--<br>
Carol Gardner PE<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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