<html><body bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><div>Nick,</div><div><br></div><div>You are absolutely right! My (so-called) feathers get ruffled way too easily, which is why I make a conscieous effort not to comment in here unless I'm 'mostly' confident that my contributions could even potentially benefit someone encountering a problem similar to one I've encountered in the past. Such constraint on behalf of all contributors would do wonders for such an environment. The quality of query in which I witness here for the most part is astonishing. (i.e. 'how do spell equest'?). Rather than doing the research on their own, or at the very least, exploring the 'onebuilding' query history, this platform makes it all too easy to ask the infamous 'stupid question', though I realize there exists no such thing. <span class="Apple-style-span" style="-webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(26, 26, 26, 0.28125); -webkit-composition-fill-color: rgba(175, 192, 227, 0.214844); -webkit-composition-frame-color: rgba(77, 128, 180, 0.214844); "></span></div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="-webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(26, 26, 26, 0.277344); -webkit-composition-fill-color: rgba(175, 192, 227, 0.210938); -webkit-composition-frame-color: rgba(77, 128, 180, 0.210938);"><br></span></div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="-webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(26, 26, 26, 0.28125); -webkit-composition-fill-color: rgba(175, 192, 227, 0.214844); -webkit-composition-frame-color: rgba(77, 128, 180, 0.214844); ">I am beginning to believe that Carol is right in suggesting a more professional and reliable authority to more acurately respond to user querries. And someone else who suggested an eQUEST-wiki might just be spot on. Thought I will admit, in an age where electronic response has become the norm, there is certainly something something quite a bit more 'personal' about receiving a reply from a beating heart. </span></div><div><br></div><div>As such, it is my feeling, that any 'responder', should not respond so specifically so as to ignore the larger question an inquiry might be addressing, particularly when a prior responder has already replied and explicitly requests additional input on his offered solution.</div><div><br></div><div>In the spirit of community (as you have suggested) I would challange anyone who posits a potential solution to address the formal issue at large, rather than simply offering his(her) two-cents in contrast simply for the purpose of seeming 'right'.</div><div><br></div><div>To do so, I am sure, would more likely benefit the group as a whole. </div><div><br></div><div>John Waller <span class="Apple-style-span" style="-webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(26, 26, 26, 0.289062); -webkit-composition-fill-color: rgba(175, 192, 227, 0.222656); -webkit-composition-frame-color: rgba(77, 128, 180, 0.222656); "></span></div><div><br></div><div><br><br>Sent from my iPhone</div><div><br>On Jul 16, 2010, at 2:55 PM, "Nick Caton" <<a href="mailto:ncaton@smithboucher.com">ncaton@smithboucher.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><div></div><blockquote type="cite"><div>
<div class="Section1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D">Hi John,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D">My perceptive powers are not the greatest, as my wife will
assure you, but I’m failing to see the reason to get any feathers need to
be hackled here (I did miss your reply, perhaps it wasn’t copied to the
list?)….<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D">The reality that DOE2 has a “no child-zone left behind act”
of sorts is just the nature of the beast, and nobody is arguing that’s
unintuitive – it’s simply something we have to learn as we become
familiar with the engine. I don’t know that I’d expect this
issue to be resolved in the next major update as it’s something a user
can work around (unlike some other more pertinent issues), as Dakota is plainly
demonstrating with his (typically) thorough response.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D">Everyone is here to help each other, rest assured (^_^)b, those
who aren’t don’t stick around long, and Dakota’s certainly been
around for awhile! If you have a “more correct” or otherwise
better solution to handling unconditioned zones before or after the wizards, I
would personally like to know also – I do the same as Dakota. I
understand others simply ignore the zone grouping wizard screens altogether
(though I find them to be quite a time-saver), so his inclusion of “simply
do this” in detailed is very appropriate to the group at large…<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D">Wishing everyone a safe and happy weekend,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D">~Nick<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D"><image001.jpg></span><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Stylus BT","sans-serif";color:#2D4D5E"><o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Stylus BT","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E"><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Stylus BT","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E">NICK CATON, E.I.T.</span></b><b><span style="font-family:"Stylus BT","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E"><o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#CC9900">PROJECT ENGINEER</span><span style="font-size:7.5pt;color:#CC9900"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E">25501 west valley parkway<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E">olathe ks 66061<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E">direct 913 344.0036<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E">fax 913 345.0617<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E">Check out our new web-site @ </span></i><span style="font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><a href="www.smithboucher.com" title="blocked::www.smithboucher.com"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">www.smithboucher.com</span></a></span><u><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:blue"> </span></u><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">
<a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>
[mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>John
David Waller<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, July 16, 2010 3:16 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Dakota Kelley<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org"><a href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] eQUEST unconditioned spaces<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Maybe I was too vague in my reply.<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I, too, was hoping for some insight into this particular
issue.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">While I do believe this to be a software (developer)
oversight, I also believe that any offered solution(s) to such a 'problem'
could be handled with slightly more dignity; perhaps even some humility!<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">It is more likely that 'this' is a software issue more than
anything else. Hopefully this, and many other issues, will have been
addressed in '3.6.4'!<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">It makes absolutely no sense to me to assign a system to
'unconditioned space' that is being used to 'condition', condition space. Since
every 'space', or zone requires the assignment of a specific mechanical system,
then wouldn't it be likely [as in the 'real world' vs. our 'virtual' one, be
equipped with 'NO" system since it is 'NOT' conditioned, versus an
'operable' system that supplies conditioning to a space that requires such?
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">While it agreed that all zone 'must belong to a system', I'm
not convinced that your [emphatic] solution employs the ideal method for
addressing such an issue. It seems to me that you're placing her back to
the same point in which she came to discover such a unique condition. <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Looking forward to a legitimate response!<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Sincerely--<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">John<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Fri, Jul 16, 2010 at 7:15 AM, Dakota Kelley <<a href="mailto:dakotak@teliospc.com"><a href="mailto:dakotak@teliospc.com">dakotak@teliospc.com</a></a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="color:#1F497D">Amber,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="color:#1F497D">If I’m following your description, you must be
specifying the unconditioned zone in Shell Wizard/Screen 2/Zone Characteristics
button. Then you’re obviously specifying system-per-floor in the
HVAC wizard. This sounds like it should work, but what is happening is
Shell Wizard/Screen 14 settings are trumping Shell Wizard/Screen 2. There
are two solutions:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><span style="color:#1F497D">1)</span><span style="font-size:7.0pt;
color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="color:#1F497D">Simply
change the zones to unconditioned in the detailed interface.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><span style="color:#1F497D">2)</span><span style="font-size:7.0pt;
color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="color:#1F497D">Create
a new zone group in Shell Wizard/Screen 14. Assign the unconditioned
zones to this group, and then make sure the “Conditioned” check box
is <i>not</i> checked. Assign the group to whatever system makes sense
and move on (making sure that at least one conditioned zone group is also
assigned to that system). All zones have to belong to a system, but if
they’re unconditioned their parent system is irrelevant. This
method is only slightly longer than the one above, but it lets you stay in the
wizard.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="color:#1F497D">If you try to leave an unconditioned “on its
own”, which I interpret as being assigned to its own single-zone system,
you’ll get an error saying every system has to have at least one
conditioned zone. Let me know if I have misunderstood you.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0">
<tbody><tr style="height:73.5pt">
<td width="86" valign="top" style="width:64.5pt;background:white;padding:0in 0in 0in 0in;
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<table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="100%" style="width:100.0%">
<tbody><tr>
<td style="padding:0in 0in 0in 0in">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
auto"><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><b>Error! Filename not specified.</b></span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody></table>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody></table>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
margin-left:.5in;text-indent:27.0pt"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;
color:black">DAKOTA KELLEY </span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
margin-left:.5in;text-indent:27.0pt"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:black">Project
Designer | Energy Analyst</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:black">
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:black">
</span><span style="font-size:8.0pt;color:black">Office:
214.744.6199
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;color:black">
Cell: 214.280.3825</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;color:black">
Fax: 214.744.0770</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:black">
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;color:black"><a href="http://www.teliospc.com/" target="_blank"><a href="http://www.teliospc.com">http://www.teliospc.com</a> </a>
3535 Travis St. Suite 115</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:8.0pt;color:black"><a href="mailto:dakotak@teliospc.com" target="_blank"><a href="mailto:dakotak@teliospc.com">dakotak@teliospc.com</a></a></span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;
color:black">
</span><span style="font-size:8.0pt;color:black">Dallas, TX 75204</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:black">
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt"> Amber
Welsh [mailto:<a href="mailto:amber@timmonsdesigneng.com" target="_blank"><a href="mailto:amber@timmonsdesigneng.com">amber@timmonsdesigneng.com</a></a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 15, 2010 9:23 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank"><a href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Equest-users] eQUEST unconditioned spaces</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">What
is the best way to handle unconditioned spaces in eQUEST? Right now, I am
zoning it separate and calling it unconditioned in the WIZARD. Then, when
I assign systems, I am putting the unconditioned zone in a system with a
conditioned space and saying “ one system per floor”. Is this
the proper way to do it?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">I
have tried just leaving the zone as unconditioned and on its own, but then when
I do the “permit submittal” calculation it still asks for the fan
flow and cooling capacity for that zone.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;color:black">Amber Welsh, P.E. </span></b><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;color:#D9D9D9">|</span></b><b><span style="font-size:
10.5pt;color:black"> </span></b><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;color:#A6A6A6">Associate</span></b><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D"><br>
</span></b><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#A6A6A6">LEED® Accredited
Professional</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
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397 5th Street NE,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span style="font-size:8.5pt;color:black">Atlanta, GA 30308 <br>
(v) 404.810.9020<br>
(c) 678.488.1967<br>
</span><a href="http://timmonsdesigneng.com/" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:8.5pt;color:red">timmonsdesigneng.com</span></a><span style="font-size:8.5pt;color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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