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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Vikram,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Thanks for correcting me – I mixed up the terminology. I guess
the point I was trying to make was, although MRT will vary throughout the zone
at each point in space – is it unfair to take a representative point (say, at
the center of each zone) and calculate the MRT at that point? In a perimeter zone
during summer the MRT would be hotter closer to the window, and cooler closer
to the core, so taking a central point would seem reasonable. What seems
difficult to me would be to take the surface temperatures (which I am now
assuming from your response we CAN retrieve from eQUEST), calculate the solid
angles and figure out to automate the process for every zone…<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I take your point that this is an average for the zone. My gut
says as long as you’re not averaging across a whole floorplate that this
methodology would be sound. I don’t mean to be contrary, I’m just interested in
learning what the software is capable of.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Alex Krickx<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#262F13'>Alex
Krickx<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:gray'>Building Energy Specialist<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><img width=121 height=42 id="_x0000_i1026"
src="cid:image001.jpg@01CB1924.2045BF30" alt="email_sig"></span><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>1250 Elko Dr, Sunnyvale, CA 94089<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>(t) 408.541.8124<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:gray'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Warning:</span></i></b><i><span style='font-size:7.5pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> The information contained
in this e-mail may be privileged attorney-client communications or attorney
work product and/or proprietary and confidential. If the reader of this
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immediately.</span></i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Sami, Vikram
[mailto:Vikram.Sami@perkinswill.com] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 01, 2010 1:40 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Alex Krickx; Grando, John; equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: MRT in eQUEST<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>The surface property is really a surface temperature (not MRT). <a
href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mean_radiant_temperature">MRT</a> is not
really a surface property of a single surface - its the average of radiant
fluxes acting on a point in space. The point is the fluxes are a result of the
view factors (solid angles) of the surfaces from that point - which is
precisely why you cannot have a single MRT for a zone. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='text-autospace:none'><b><span style='font-size:9.0pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'>Vikram Sami</span></b><span
style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'>, LEED AP<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='text-autospace:none'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'>Sustainable Design Analyst<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='text-autospace:none'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'>1382 Peachtree St. NE, Atlanta, GA
30309<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='text-autospace:none'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'>t: 404-443-7462
f: </span><span lang=ES style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:gray'>404.892.5823 </span><span style='font-size:9.0pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'> e:
vikram.sami@perkinswill.com </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><a
href="http://www.perkinswill.com/"><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray;text-decoration:none'>www.perkinswill.com</span></a></span><span
style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:3.0pt;text-autospace:none'><b><span
style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'>Perkins+Will.</span></b><span
style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'> </span><span
style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#ADD425'>Ideas +
buildings that honor the broader goals of society</span><span style='font-size:
9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:green'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Alex Krickx [mailto:akrickx@seriousmaterials.com]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 01, 2010 4:33 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Sami, Vikram; Grando, John; equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: MRT in eQUEST<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I read John’s question as asking: can you get the MRT for each
surface? – perhaps I misread it. I would assume, though, that if you could get
it for each surface, than you could calculate the PMV of each zone. Your end
result would show that zone A had -4 and B had +4 and they wouldn’t be averaged
together. This approach would understand and provide results that back up
Vikram’s point that a space near a façade will experience different MRT than a
core zone. Is that not possible in eQUEST?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Alex Krickx<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#262F13'>Alex
Krickx<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:gray'>Building Energy Specialist<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><img border=0 width=121 height=42 id="Picture_x0020_1"
src="cid:image001.jpg@01CB1924.2045BF30" alt="email_sig"></span><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>1250 Elko Dr, Sunnyvale, CA 94089<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>(t) 408.541.8124<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:gray'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Warning:</span></i></b><i><span style='font-size:7.5pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> The information contained
in this e-mail may be privileged attorney-client communications or attorney
work product and/or proprietary and confidential. If the reader of this
message is not the intended recipient then you have received it in error and
any review, distribution or copying of this message is prohibited and you are
to notify us immediately by reply e-mail and delete the original message
immediately.</span></i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>
equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Sami,
Vikram<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 01, 2010 1:17 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Grando, John; equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] MRT in eQUEST<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>John,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I'm guessing you wouldn't be doing this analysis on a project
unless you were concerned about thermal comfort issues from skin related
stimuli. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>So if you had a PMV of +4 in one zone and -4 in another would
you say that on average everyone in your building is comfortable? <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Calculating MRT in a lumped node simulation program is kind of
like that - an average MRT for a zone is often misleading. For example - a room
with a large west window in the summer time will have a much higher MRT for
someone sitting next to the window than for someone sitting near an interior
wall on the other side - especially if there is direct sunlight in the room.
Similarly - in winter - proximity to a north window might result in a much
lower MRT than for someone sitting near the core. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Bottom line - you pick the tool that's appropriate to the
analysis. You really want a full-field solution tool (like a CFD program or a
thermal software like RADtherm) to perform comfort analyses like this. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='text-autospace:none'><b><span style='font-size:9.0pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'>Vikram Sami</span></b><span
style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'>, LEED AP<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='text-autospace:none'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'>Sustainable Design Analyst<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='text-autospace:none'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'>1382 Peachtree St. NE, Atlanta, GA
30309<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='text-autospace:none'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'>t: 404-443-7462
f: </span><span lang=ES style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:gray'>404.892.5823 </span><span style='font-size:9.0pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'> e: <a
href="mailto:vikram.sami@perkinswill.com">vikram.sami@perkinswill.com</a>
</span><a href="http://www.perkinswill.com/"><span style='font-size:9.0pt;
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style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'>Perkins+Will.</span></b><span
style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'> </span><span
style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#ADD425'>Ideas +
buildings that honor the broader goals of society</span><span style='font-size:
9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:green'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>
equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Grando,
John<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 01, 2010 3:36 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Equest-users] MRT in eQUEST<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hello
All,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>I
have to calculate the PMV for a zone and I did the analysis already in
eQUEST. I need the mean radiant temperature though to perform this
calc. I am pretty sure that MRT is not an output variable so I'm guessing
I need to calculate the wall temperatures and do it myself. Has anyone
tried to do this before? I didn't find anything in the archives or in the
DOE22 manual. Thanks.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<div style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:blue'>John Grando</span></b><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> </span></b><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'>LEED AP</span></b><b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>| </span></b><b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:gray'>Mechanical
Engineer</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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