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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Dakota:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>There is definitely diversity in the zones and I have used the
glass library for all window types. Also, I agree that not having reheat is
inappropriate for this building use due to the programmatic and occupancy
diversity within each zone (there are two AHU's feeding multiple zones in the
proposed design and I have maintained those thermal blocks per ASHRAE appendix
G). Unfortunately the baseline system I have described is what is required per
the "Required Treatment of District Thermal Energy" document for LEED
compliance. Assuming the system is functioning correctly (or as best as
possible considering the design) and the heating loads are not met would LEED
allow the addition of zone level baseboards for purposes of the Optimized
Energy credit?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Note: I have included the suggestions listed below (except for
local baseboard heating) and the improvement in unmet hours is marginal.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Thanks -<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";
color:windowtext'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'> Dakota Kelley
[mailto:dakotak@teliospc.com] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, June 11, 2010 9:40 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> desrosiers@studioma.com<br>
<b>Cc:</b> equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [Equest-users] Excessive Unmet Heating Load Hours withan
Auto-Sized HVAC System<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Robert,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>50,000 hours is much more than I would anticipate for a capacity
issue. You are essentially describing a hydronic VAVT system, which is
begging for unmet heating hours if there is a lot of diversity in the zones’
demands and no reheat capabilities. My experience has been that eQUEST
over-sizes hot water systems, and this is exacerbated if the “simple” method is
used to define the windows. It can be as much as 250%-300%.
That many hours sounds like the system is not functioning as intended – almost
as if the heating loop is not assigned to the zones/system, or something
similar. Or, not having reheat could be inappropriate for the building
use or climate. Regardless, adding zone reheat as Bruce and Pasha
indicated should make a huge difference.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Thanks,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
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<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in;text-indent:27.0pt'><b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book"'>DAKOTA KELLEY </span><o:p></o:p></b></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in;text-indent:27.0pt'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book"'>Project Designer |
Energy Analyst<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book"'>
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book"'>
</span><span
style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book"'>Office:
214.744.6199
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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Cell: 214.280.3825<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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Fax: 214.744.0770</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book"'>
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><a href="http://www.teliospc.com/"><span style='font-size:
8.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book"'>http://www.teliospc.com </span></a><span
style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book"'>
3535 Travis St. Suite 115<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><a href="mailto:dakotak@teliospc.com"><span
style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book"'>dakotak@teliospc.com</span></a><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book"'>
</span><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book"'>Dallas,
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<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book";
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";
color:windowtext'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'> Bruce Easterbrook
[mailto:bruce5@bellnet.ca] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, June 11, 2010 6:33 AM<br>
<b>Cc:</b> equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] Excessive Unmet Heating Load Hours withan
Auto-Sized HVAC System<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal>In your air side HVAC section go into the zone level and check
that your sizing option is set to "adjust loads". If it is from
loads go to the summary tab and change all your zones. Also beside that
is throttling range, you can try adjusting that upwards say to 4 deg. You
can also change your control zone to see it this helps. If your AHU is
off at night you can also adjust it to come on before the occupancy. You
SS-O report will show this if the hours are lumped near the start up
time. Then add more heat as Pasha said.<br>
Bruce Easterbrook P.Eng.<br>
Abode Engineering<br>
<br>
On 10/06/2010 10:55 PM, Pasha Korber-Gonzalez wrote: <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal>I have found with my own projects that even sometimes when
the HVAC designer has specified a specific capacity for htg water equipment
that sometime in my model file I still have unmet loads for htg. I
suggest at this point specify additional htg capacity by either increasing the
reheat delta-T from say 30F to 50F and/or adding zone level baseboards.
By adding the baseboards you are adding a component of the system that will
supplement the skin losses being experienced by the simulation model.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal>by adding baseboards for the additional requrired heat then
you should be able to meet your heating loads.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal>hope this helps,<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>pasha<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal>On Thu, Jun 10, 2010 at 7:38 PM, Robert Des Rosiers <<a
href="mailto:desrosiers@studioma.com">desrosiers@studioma.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>All:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>I
have completed an energy model for a baseline scenario from which to compare my
proposed design. The baseline HVAC system is a constant volume single
zone AHU w/ no reheat; the AHU is served by HW and CHW loop from a central
plant. I have set this up in eQuest as a "Variable Air Volume"
system type with the AHU fan control set to "Constant Volume"; my
thought here is that each zone fed by the AHU will control temperature using a
VAV box w/ no local reheat or cooling. Flow and temperature from the AHU
will be delivered based on the coolest or warmest zone it serves.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>All
seems fine with the design flows, ventilation flows and cooling
capacities. My problem is with the heating capacity as I have excessive
unmet heating hours (50,000). I have allowed eQuest to size the heating
capacity of the preheat and heating coil as well as the minimum flow
ratios. <u>Does anyone have any thoughts as to what is causing these
unmet heating load hours? Is the way I have set-up the desired baseline
HVAC system incorrect?</u><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Any
guidance is greatly appreciated. Thanks -<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='color:#1F497D'>Robert Des Rosiers, LEED-AP</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='color:#1F497D'>STUDIO MA</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='color:#1F497D'>130 N Central Avenue, No.300 Phoenix, Arizona 85004</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='color:#1F497D'>Telephone 602 251 3800</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>Equest-users mailing list<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a
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