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<font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">Strange, I just got 2 McAfee
GroupShield alert</font>s on something coming from onebuilding.org.
time stamp 18:01:24. I don't run McAfee on my systems. My system did
scan your incoming email and files Greg, no warnings. I sent a reply
to your 3:00 pm email about 7:30 my time, did you receive that? I
haven't opened your files but if I get a chance I will scan them and
open them on an old computer. Thanks for the warning.<br>
Bruce<br>
<br>
On 09/04/2010 07:26 PM, Greg Collins wrote:
<blockquote
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<div class="Section1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">So
apparently somebody’s
computer started doing some funky stuff after download the files I
attached to
my previous email.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">DO NOT
DOWNLOAD THEM until it’s
figured out if they caused her problems.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Was
anybody else able to
successfully open them or have similar problems?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Greg<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div
style="border-style: solid none none; border-color: rgb(181, 196, 223) -moz-use-text-color -moz-use-text-color; border-width: 1pt medium medium; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif"; color: windowtext;">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif"; color: windowtext;">
Greg Collins <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, April 09, 2010 3:00 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'Bruce Easterbrook'<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [Equest-users] Active Chilled Beam/Fan Coil System<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Thanks to
everybody for the
interest and feedback so far..<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Chilled
water supply to the
beams is 56F. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I’ve
attached my inp and pd2
files in case anybody wants a closer look. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Greg<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div
style="border-style: solid none none; border-color: rgb(181, 196, 223) -moz-use-text-color -moz-use-text-color; border-width: 1pt medium medium; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif"; color: windowtext;">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif"; color: windowtext;">
Bruce Easterbrook
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:bruce5@bellnet.ca">mailto:bruce5@bellnet.ca</a>] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, April 09, 2010 2:24 PM<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] Active Chilled Beam/Fan Coil System<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Maybe you are now running into what eQuest uses
to prevent
condensation on the chilled beam coil. Condensation would be allowed
in
the FCU as it could/would have a drain tray. Where the mixing takes
place
is important on the chilled beam. eQuest should consider the mixing
takes
place after the coil and the warm humid air is entering the coil. I
would
think eQuest would be set up to prevent condensation on the coil, you
don't
want water dripping out of the unit. What is the temperature of your
chilled water supply?<br>
Bruce<br>
<br>
On 09/04/2010 04:32 PM, Greg Collins wrote: <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I have
tried it, but I end up
getting an error saying the leaving air temp off the coil needs to be
at least
6F higher than the entering water temp to the coil, and for some reason
I don’t
get the same error for the FCU. In an active chilled beam, the coil is
actually just cooling the room induction air, then mixing it with the
primary
air from the DOAS. I think that equest assumes the air mixes before
entering the coil, which fundamentally is the same thing, but the
numbers trip
this error message. I’ll look into more why the FC system doesn’t make
that happen, but the two seem to be essentially the same system except
for the
fan (which I make 0.000001 kW/cfm anyway).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div
style="border-style: solid none none; border-color: -moz-use-text-color; border-width: 1pt medium medium; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif"; color: windowtext;">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif"; color: windowtext;">
Grando, John [<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:JGrando@cosentini.com">mailto:JGrando@cosentini.com</a>] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, April 09, 2010 1:00 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Greg Collins; Bruce Easterbrook<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [Equest-users] Active Chilled Beam/Fan Coil System</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: blue;">Have
you looked into SYSTEM TYPE = IU (Induction Unit).
This may be a better path to try.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: "Times New Roman","serif"; color: windowtext;"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p><br>
<b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: blue;">John
Grando</span></b><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">
</span></b><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: blue;">LEED
AP</span></b><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">| </span></b><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: gray;">Mechanical
Engineer</span><br>
</b><br>
<br>
<span style="font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";"> </span> <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: "Times New Roman","serif"; color: windowtext;"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: "Times New Roman","serif"; color: windowtext;"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="text-align: center;" align="center"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: "Times New Roman","serif"; color: windowtext;">
<hr align="center" size="2" width="100%"></span></div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif"; color: windowtext;">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif"; color: windowtext;">
Greg Collins [<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:GCollins@glumac.com">mailto:GCollins@glumac.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, April 09, 2010 2:00 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Bruce Easterbrook<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] Active Chilled Beam/Fan Coil System</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Bruce,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I agree
with your theory and the
justification, but the question is ultimately “how to model it?” I
don’t
think you can put in negative heat for a baseboard system, hook it up
to a
chilled water loop and get results you can count on. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Greg</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div
style="border-style: solid none none; border-color: -moz-use-text-color; border-width: 1pt medium medium; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif"; color: windowtext;">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif"; color: windowtext;">
Bruce Easterbrook [<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:bruce5@bellnet.ca">mailto:bruce5@bellnet.ca</a>] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, April 09, 2010 8:59 AM<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] Active Chilled Beam/Fan Coil System</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> I'm not totally up on using DOAS with
eQuest or with chilled beams being in Canada but it would seem to me
the OA
will have to be used to control humidity in the space. The chilled
beam
should not be used for latent cooling, sensible only, to prevent
condensation
issues. The DOAS will need to control the dewpoint of the room air and
maintain it below the operating temperature of the coil in the chilled
beam. The chilled beam would only be dealing with the sensible load
from
the space. The DOAS would do everything else. The question would be
will eQuest allow a single zone AHU c/w economizer and a baseboard
system with
negative heat? I have never tried that with eQuest.<br>
Bruce Easterbrook<br>
Abode Engineering<br>
<br>
On 08/04/2010 04:46 PM, James Hansen wrote: <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I’m
interested in this as well –
I know that in DOAS systems like active chilled beams, the primary air
often
takes on a fairly large chunk of space latent cooling, and if this
can’t be
passed on from the DOAS system to the space, then I don’t see how we
can
believe the results.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: teal;">GHT
Limited<br>
</span></b><b><span style="font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">James
Hansen</span>,
PE, LEED AP</b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">Senior
Associate</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 7.5pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">1010
N. Glebe Rd, Suite 200</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 7.5pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">Arlington,
VA
22201-4749</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 7.5pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">703-338-5754
(Cell)</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 7.5pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">703-243-1200
(Office)</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 7.5pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">703-276-1376
(Fax)</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: teal;"><a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.ghtltd.com/"><span
style="font-size: 10pt;">www.ghtltd.com</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="color: rgb(49, 132, 155);"> </span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div
style="border-style: solid none none; border-color: -moz-use-text-color; border-width: 1pt medium medium; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif";">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif";"> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>
[<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org">mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Greg Collins<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 08, 2010 4:39 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Equest-users] Active Chilled Beam/Fan Coil System</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Hi all,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">I’m working on modeling an active chilled beam
system.
It consists of the chilled beams and a dedicated unit to provide
primary air
(mainly ventilation air) to the beams at 55 degrees. I’ve modeled the
chilled beam system as a fan coil system, but am wondering about my
options for
modeling the primary air. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">My question is this: If I attach the
primary/ventilation air unit to the fan coil system in the FC’s Outdoor
Air tab
under “Outside Air from System” will the temperature of the air coming
from
that unit have an impact on the load in the space? I have a ton of
hours
at very low load during the winter months, and I want eQuest to use the
55
degree primary air as the first stage of cooling for the space and not
“double
up” the cooling energy by cooling the 55 degree air and then not use
that for
cooling in the zones.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">If anybody has some input, it would be
appreciated. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">Greg
Collins</span></b><span
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: "Times New Roman","serif";"><br>
</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">Design
Engineer / Energy Analyst</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">Mechanical
Department</span><span
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: "Times New Roman","serif";"><br>
</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">LEED®
Accredited Professional</span><span
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: "Times New Roman","serif";"><br>
<br>
</span><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.glumac.com/"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: "Times New Roman","serif"; text-decoration: none;"><img
id="Picture_x0020_1" src="cid:part1.05080901.01080506@bellnet.ca"
alt="http://www.glumac.com/glumacsig.gif" border="0" height="41"
width="343"></span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: "Times New Roman","serif";">
<hr style="color: rgb(154, 203, 51);" align="left" noshade="noshade"
size="2" width="100%"></span></div>
</div>
</div>
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</div>
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</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: red;">NOTE
OUR NEW ADDRESS</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">18200
Von Karman Ave., Suite 100</span><span
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: "Times New Roman","serif";"><br>
</span><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">Irvine,
CA 92612</span><span
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: "Times New Roman","serif";"><br>
</span><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";">T.
949.833.8190 F. 949.833.0252<br>
<br>
</span><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: rgb(51, 51, 51);">Thinking.
Inside the building.</span></b><span
style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif";"><br>
</span><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: rgb(51, 51, 51);"><a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.glumac.com/">www.glumac.com</a></span><span
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