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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Thank you all. I see that the below 20% load, where I was
predominantly operating, the KW/Ton shoots up drastically. Thanks, that
explains my results.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Respectfully,</span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Brett Sanicola</span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Engineer</span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>ASB Engineering</span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>(516) 785-4200</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:
"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>
equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Jim
Marsh<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 01, 2010 4:25 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'Pasha Korber-Gonzalez'; 'James Hansen'<br>
<b>Cc:</b> equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] Chiller ROI - HELP!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif";
color:blue'>Brett, attached are some example kw/ton curves for existing
chillers on a recent project. Chiller #1 is a 250 ton unit, and chillers
2 thru 4 are 550 ton units. Chillers 1 and 2 are ~ 15 years old, and
chillers 3 and 4 are newer with better efficiencies. All 4 chillers are
water cooled. The curves show efficiencies with and without Adjustable
Frequency Drives. It's hard to tell the difference between the
"w/AFD" and "w/o AFD" curves, but the "w/AFD"
curves have a lower kw/ton except at full load.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"'>Jim
Marsh, PE, LEED AP</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"'>SEG,
Inc.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"'>2550
Walsh Avenue</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"'>Suite
120</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"'>Santa
Clara, CA 95051</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"'>Desk:
408 260 8008 Ext 210</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"'>Cell:
408 656 3096</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"'>Fax:
408 260 8018</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><a href="http://seg-corp.com/"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Trebuchet MS","sans-serif"'>http://seg-corp.com/</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>This communication
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<span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p align=center style='text-align:center'><i><span style='font-size:10.5pt;
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<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Pasha
Korber-Gonzalez<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 01, 2010 1:11 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> James Hansen<br>
<b>Cc:</b> equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Equest-users] Chiller ROI - HELP!</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal>Brett,<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal>to get better part load data and efficiency of your proposed
chiller replacement, call your chill sales engineer and ask them to generate a
part load performance report for you in 10% unloading increments, then you can
see the decrease in performance efficiency for each part-load step of the
chiller. Also be sure that you recognize if you are looking at RATED
Conditions (which means chiller performance at ARI standard conditions), or at
DESIGN conditions (which are your project's specified operating
conditions--this would account for part load efficiencies if you were running a
12-or 14 Degree delta-T across your chiller.)<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal>Before you set up a new performance curve you will need to
get this data supplied from the manufacturer.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Pasha<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal>On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 2:01 PM, James Hansen <<a
href="mailto:JHANSEN@ghtltd.com">JHANSEN@ghtltd.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='color:#1F497D'>KW/ton drops off with decreasing part load, and since the
chiller isn’t always operating at ARI full load conditions, you can’t just
divide total chiller energy consumption (in KWH) by the total cooling load (in
btu) and hope to get anywhere near the full load rated KW/ton.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='color:#1F497D'>As you go about this ROI study, make sure that when you
are analyzing your proposed chiller replacement, that you create a custom EIR
vs PLR curve based on manufacturer’s data, otherwise you’re using a default
DOE-2 curve that isn’t necessarily correct.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='color:#1F497D'>Furthermore, to make the study worthwhile, the existing
chiller model really needs to be normalized as best as possible to actual
building operating conditions. You can get away without doing it for a
simple comparison, but it would be more accurate if you normalized to utility
bills.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='color:teal'>GHT Limited<br>
</span><span style='color:black'>James Hansen, PE, LEED AP</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>Senior Associate</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:7.5pt;color:black'>1010 N. Glebe Rd, Suite 200</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:7.5pt;color:black'>Arlington, VA 22201-4749</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:7.5pt;color:black'>703-338-5754 (Cell)</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:7.5pt;color:black'>703-243-1200 (Office)</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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style='font-size:7.5pt;color:black'>703-276-1376 (Fax)</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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style='color:teal'><a href="http://www.ghtltd.com/" target="_blank"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>www.ghtltd.com</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <a
href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>
[mailto:<a href="mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org"
target="_blank">equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of
</b>Brett Sanicola<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 01, 2010 2:38 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Equest-users] Chiller ROI - HELP!</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>I've
been attempting to calculate a simple ROI for a new 250 ton chiller our client
wants to install to replace his older chiller. I ran the simulation for
the default "high rise hotel" construction which, to my luck, is
quite similar to the actual building. The detailed results, however, are
not making sense to me. Specifically, when I look at Equipment Loads and
Energy Use for the Chiller, the Elec Use and Cool Load don't coincide given the
default Chiller efficiency of .67kw/ton. For example they give a Chiller
Elec Use of 535453 KWH and a Cool Load of 3294 MBTU. However, according
to my calculations, at .67KW/TON, 535453 KWH should give me closer to 9590
MBTU. I see most of the hours are in part load range, but does the
efficiency drop off that dramatically at part load that it would explain the
discrepancy? Which numbers should I base my analysis on, the Cool Load
number or the Elec Use number.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Also,
on the same page (Equipment Loads and Energy Usage), it gives me a peak load of
2436 KBTU/HR. However, when I go to the section titled "Building
Peak Load Components" the peak cooling load is significantly less (1619
KBTU/HR)<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>At
this point, I have no idea what any number represents, since I don’t know how
it was calculated.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>I
greatly appreciate any help! Thanks.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Respectfully,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Brett Sanicola</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Engineer</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>ASB Engineering</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>(516) 785-4200</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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