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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Thanks, I can see your point when looking
at the schematics. But, how do I reconcile the tree structure without two
circulation loops with the DOE Topics Vol. 2, p. 312-313, merged and pasted
below?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><img width=943 height=1055
id="_x0000_i1031" src="cid:image001.gif@01C98799.DA0B27C0"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>____________________________</span></font><font
color=navy><span style='color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Karl Stum, PE</span></font><font
color=navy><span style='color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>360 573 5700 ofc<br>
360 771 0918 cell</span></font><font color=navy><span style='color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceName w:st="on"><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Summit</span></font></st1:PlaceName><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> <st1:PlaceType
w:st="on">Building</st1:PlaceType></span></font></st1:place><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> Engineering</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> Paul
Riemer [mailto:Paul.Riemer@dunhameng.com] <br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Thursday, February 05, 2009
1:42 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> 'Karl Stum'<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></b> 'Dennis Hunt'<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> RE: [Equest-users]
Primary-secondary loop configuration</span></font><font size=3><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>Karl,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>Maybe you and I are
on opposite sides of the naming convention too but I will offer my take on the
naming issues. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>In your first screen
capture. I would call the "Chlr#* (Screw) Pump"s dedicated
primary pumps on implied primary loops and the "Chilled Water Loop"
is a secondary loop with "CHW Loop Pump" the secondary loop pump.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>In your second
screen capture, I would still call the "Chlr#* (Screw) Pump"s
dedicated primary pumps on implied primary loops, the "Primary CHW
Loop" is a secondary loop without a pump and your "Secondary CHW
Loop" is a tertiary loop with a pump.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>Good luck,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>Paul<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:
0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> Karl Stum
[mailto:kstum@summitbe.com] <br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Thursday, February 05, 2009
3:19 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> Paul Riemer<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></b> 'Dennis Hunt'<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> RE: [Equest-users]
Primary-secondary loop configuration<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Paul,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Thanks for the response.
Here’s the tree structure. It only shows one loop. I really question the
validity of what the Wizard is doing. So, I went into the detailed mode and
created another circulation loop and set it up the way I think it should be,
but if that is right, then the 100’s of Wizard set ups by modelers
everywhere are messed up, and I doubt that???? See the tree from the
detailed set up I did in the second image below. The problem with that one is I
can’t get the one coil load to get off the primary loop and I don’t
trust it, if it is so different than what the Wizard sets up.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><img width=824
height=676 id="_x0000_i1026" src="cid:image002.jpg@01C98799.DA0B27C0"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>DETAILED SETUP CREATING A
SECONDARY CIRCULATION LOOP. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Now chillers are assigned
to the primary loop, the secondary loop assigned to primary loop and loads are
assigned to secondary loop (except when I assign the DDS(B) load to the
secondary, it looks OK in the tree, but the schematic looses the secondary loop
altogether??).<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><img width=807
height=505 id="_x0000_i1028" src="cid:image003.jpg@01C98799.DA0B27C0"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>____________________________</span></font><font
color=navy><span style='color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Karl Stum, PE</span></font><font
color=navy><span style='color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>360 573 5700 ofc<br>
360 771 0918 cell</span></font><font color=navy><span style='color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceName
w:st="on"><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Summit</span></font></st1:PlaceName><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> <st1:PlaceType w:st="on">Building</st1:PlaceType></span></font></st1:place><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> Engineering</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div style='margin-left:.5in'>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;
text-align:center'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:
0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> Paul
Riemer [mailto:Paul.Riemer@dunhameng.com] <br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Thursday, February 05, 2009
1:07 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> 'Karl Stum';
equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> RE: [Equest-users]
Primary-secondary loop configuration</span></font><font size=3><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color="#1f497d"
face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>Karl,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color="#1f497d"
face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>EQUEST's
pump & loop naming is unconventional and confusing. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color="#1f497d"
face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>I
think you are have solved it and looking at the water side component tree view
with all the +'s expanded should solidify it for you.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color="#1f497d"
face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>Let's
just all be thankful that DOE2.2 gives us multiple loops and pump curves.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color="#1f497d"
face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>Paul<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color="#1f497d"
face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color="#1f497d"
face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><font size=2 color="#1f497d"
face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:
0in;margin-left:1.0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:equest-users-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <b><span style='font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Karl Stum<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Thursday, February 05, 2009
2:41 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b>
equest-users@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> [Equest-users]
Primary-secondary loop configuration<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><font size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><font size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:11.0pt'>Chilled water primary-secondary loop configuration.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><font size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:11.0pt'>When using the eQuest Wizard and a primary-secondary
chilled water pumping system is set up, I don’t see the secondary
circulation loop in the tree structure. Furthermore, per the DOE documentation,
the chillers would be assigned to the primary loop and the cooling loads
assigned to the secondary loop (DOE2 Topics Vol 2, p. 312-313), but the results
from the Wizard show in the tree structure everything assigned to the primary
loop, as does the output PV-A Plant Design Parameters report. In that report,
the chillers do show term called “(Run-around)” by their
evaporators. Is this supposed to be what we would normally call the primary
loop? Why aren’t there two circulation loops showing up in the tree
structure?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><font size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:11.0pt'>Thanks,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><font size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:11.0pt'>Karl<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>_____________________________________</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Karl Stum, PE</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceName
w:st="on"><strong><b><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>Summit</span></font></b></strong></st1:PlaceName><strong><b><font
size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> <st1:PlaceType
w:st="on">Building</st1:PlaceType></span></font></b></strong></st1:place><strong><b><font
size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> Engineering</span></font></b></strong><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><st1:Street w:st="on"><st1:address
w:st="on"><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Arial'>2516 NW 91st Street</span></font></st1:address></st1:Street><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City
w:st="on"><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Arial'>Vancouver</span></font></st1:City><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>, <st1:State w:st="on">WA</st1:State>
<st1:PostalCode w:st="on">98665</st1:PostalCode></span></font></st1:place><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>v. 360 573 5700</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>c. 360 771 0918</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>f. 360 573 5155</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><font size=2 face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><a href="http://www.summitbe.com">http://www.summitbe.com</a></span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:1.0in'><font size=2 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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