[Equest-users] new user SIR and funding inquiry

Tue Mar 24 07:18:22 PDT 2020

Here is the description of the eQUEST "ECONOMICS" simulation:
http://doe2.com/download/DOE-22/DOE22Vol2-Dictionary_48r.pdf

Excerpt in particular for the comparison to a CD the discount factor would be the tool used for this:
DISCOUNT-RATE Specifies the discount rate (in percent), which is the factor used in a present-value method of economic evaluation that accounts for the time value of money. It represents the "cost of capital" or "the opportunity to earn from normal investment activity," and is used to discount future recurring costs and/or benefits to present value in decision making. One way of understanding the concept of present value and discount rate is to think of a reduced sum of money being put aside today to cover future costs. The discount rate is the interest rate applied to that sum, compounded each year, to yield in the future an amount exactly equal to the future cost. The same concept is applied to future benefits, to find their present value.

So I believe the tools are there - I'm not sure about fuel escalation, or if TREAT handles fuel escalation, (or if you need to use escalation at all), or why the results would be off by a factor of 10 - we'd need more info on the specific measure and savings results / costs to diagnose that one. It could be a result of the formula, or it could be variation in how the measure is modeled in each program and using the same/similar formula.

David

David S. Eldridge, Jr., P.E., BEMP, BEAP, HBDP, GGA
Associate

Direct: (847) 316-9224 | Mobile: (773) 490-5038

Grumman/Butkus Associates | 820 Davis Street, Suite 300 | Evanston, IL 60201
Energy Efficiency Consultants and Sustainable Design Engineers

grummanbutkus.com<http://grummanbutkus.com/> | Blog<http://grummanbutkus.com/blog> | Facebook<https://www.facebook.com/pages/GrummanButkus-Associates/1385285015032526> | Twitter<https://twitter.com/grummanbutkus>

From: Boyle, Daniel <Daniel.Boyle at seattle.gov>
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2020 6:55 PM
To: David Eldridge <DEldridge at grummanbutkus.com>; Nicholas Caton <Nicholas.Caton at se.com>; equest-users at onebuilding.org; Scott Criswell <scott at sacss.com>
Cc: Rogers, Charlie <Charlie.Rogers at seattle.gov>
Subject: Re: new user SIR and funding inquiry

Thank you all for your input.

The source and regulating body we are interested in proposing this solution to is; WA Department of Commerce. Specifically Wx programs for multifamily buildings. We are hoping to find a solution or product already approved by DOE, has a favorable SIR formula, and is on our state approved software submittal list. EQuest is on the list, and that is why I was checking it out.

The list of 15 programs is on page 10,11 of this document:

https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2019/04/f61/wpn-19-4-attachments.pdf

The current software we are using, TREAT, uses this formula for SIR, taking the time value of money into account. WA Department of Commerce may be choosing a software product to replace TREAT.

here is the formula:

[cid:image003.png at 01D601B1.66001950]

This gives us funding amounts for measures that work well. When I use the eQuest SIR formula, the funding result is about one tenth of the same measure in TREAT.

Is it possible that the built-in LCI featuresetj mentioned (or a version of it) are DOE approved? and eQuest might, if used in the correct manor would work?

Do you know a program or existing Excel spreadsheet in use that will take eQuest CSV import, has a similar SIR to the TREAT formula, and might already approved by DOE?

We would like to find an approved program because, at this time we can not invest ourselves in writing it and then work on getting it approved.

We could export the CSV file to LCCA spreadsheet (DOE2) if there is an approved SIR formula in existence.

Thanks again,

[cid:image004.png at 01D601B1.66001950]Daniel Boyle
Property Weatherization & Rehabilitation Specialist
City of Seattle, Office of Housing<http://www.seattle.gov/housing>, HomeWise Program
PO Box 94725, Seattle, WA  98124-4725

O: 206.684.0237 | F: 206.233.7117 | daniel.boyle at seattle.gov<mailto:daniel.boyle at seattle.gov>

http://www.seattle.gov/housing/housing-developers/multifamily-weatherization

[cid:image005.png at 01D601B1.66001950]<http://www.seattlecensus.org/>

   FAQS<http://www.seattlecensus.org/faq/>  | BLOG<http://www.seattlecensus.org/blog/>

________________________________
From: David Eldridge <DEldridge at grummanbutkus.com<mailto:DEldridge at grummanbutkus.com>>
Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2020 11:21 AM
To: Nicholas Caton <Nicholas.Caton at se.com<mailto:Nicholas.Caton at se.com>>; Boyle, Daniel <Daniel.Boyle at seattle.gov<mailto:Daniel.Boyle at seattle.gov>>; equest-users at onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at onebuilding.org> <equest-users at onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at onebuilding.org>>
Subject: RE: new user SIR and funding inquiry

CAUTION: External Email

I agree Nick, I had always used Excel for these functions (including a LCCA spreadsheet supplied on the DOE2 website) rather than the built-in functions. The flexibility and transparency is much higher. Even if "accurate" I don't prefer the black box calculation in general. Same thing for BLCC program - I'd rather use a spreadsheet to do the same thing according to the NIST method in Handbook 135.

David

David S. Eldridge, Jr., P.E., BEMP, BEAP, HBDP, GGA

Associate

Direct: (847) 316-9224 | Mobile: (773) 490-5038

Grumman/Butkus Associates | 820 Davis Street, Suite 300 | Evanston, IL 60201

Energy Efficiency Consultants and Sustainable Design Engineers

grummanbutkus.com<http://grummanbutkus.com/> | Blog<http://grummanbutkus.com/blog> | Facebook<https://www.facebook.com/pages/GrummanButkus-Associates/1385285015032526> | Twitter<https://twitter.com/grummanbutkus>

From: Equest-users <equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org>> On Behalf Of Nicholas Caton via Equest-users
Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2020 11:00 AM
To: Boyle, Daniel <Daniel.Boyle at seattle.gov<mailto:Daniel.Boyle at seattle.gov>>
Cc: equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] new user SIR and funding inquiry

The group I work with has an arsenal of excel-based templates used to perform financial analyses of these sorts directly off of eQuest-generated outputs (proprietary, sorry).  While I can't share these with outside parties, I can assert they aren't that hard to make if you have a real business need to develop something for repeated use.  There isn't any particularly special programming or economic analysis knowledge required to hook eQuest outputs into Excel, but as a key tip you can open up the hourly results of any simulation or parametric run by pointing Excel towards the .hsr file generated with any baseline or parametric run.  That can be opened as a CSV file, and from there you have all of your savings down to an hourly interval to work from.

That said, it might be easier/faster to develop a workflow process leveraging the built-in LCI featuresetj.  It has been some time since I explored that, but IIRC this does allow you to arrive at a robustly determined present value for savings over a specified period, right?  That would represent the bulk of the effort in arriving at an savings investment ratio.

You might get some more locality/task-specific advice from other eQuest users if you can identify the "funding sources" you're trying to comply with.

Regards,

~Nick

[cid:image006.jpg at 01D601B1.66001950]

Nick Caton, P.E., BEMP

  Senior Energy Engineer

  Energy and Sustainability Services
  Energy Performance Contracting

D
M
E

913 . 564 . 6361

785 . 410 . 3317

nicholas.caton at se.com<mailto:nicholas.caton at se.com>

15200 Santa Fe Trail Drive
Suite 204
Lenexa, KS 66219

[cid:image007.png at 01D601B1.66001950]

From: Equest-users <equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org>> On Behalf Of Boyle, Daniel via Equest-users
Sent: Wednesday, March 18, 2020 5:50 PM
To: equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>
Subject: [Equest-users] new user SIR and funding inquiry

[External email: Use caution with links and attachments]

________________________________

Hello, I am a new user who is trying out the software (eQuest) as a possible weatherization program tool.

I have signed up to the user group but have not received my confirmation e-mail yet. I have been getting familiar with eQuest for about a total of 20 hours.

My first task after doing some basic modeling is to try out the SIR calculation in the financial tools.

The SIR calculation in eQuest is completely different than the SIR calculation in our current software which is accepted by our funding sources.

Is there any overlay, plug-in, script, or similar that might allow for different financial formulas to be inserted into the program?

Anyone with any ideas, leads on where to look, or organizations to contact, about modifying, proposing or implementing equest into government program guidelines would be fantastic.

Thanks,

Daniel Boyle

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