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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body bgcolor=white lang=EN-US link="#0563C1" vlink="#954F72"><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>Hi Joe,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>I have absolutely no intention to suggest that paid stuff are of inferior quality compared to the free stuff. Like you said, they must be judged on their own merits, not by the price tag. My argument is that the real effort behind "free" stuff, should it be driven by public/commercial funds or personal endeavor, can easily be overlooked. It is unfortunately human nature not to pay attention to the things that can be obtained easily... (I am thinking about energy, now.) By the way, I do believe people's personal commitment is a much stronger driver for quality than money. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>The thing that irritated me was the cliché such as "the only good thing about ... is its price", even though it may be true in certain situations. Have you ever heard wise men saying "the most expensive kind of advice is free advice"? If that is true, people should be fleeing from this forum right now ;-)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>Yi<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><a name="_MailEndCompose"><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></a></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'> Bldg-sim [mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Joe Huang via Bldg-sim<br><b>Sent:</b> 15 November 2016 20:18<br><b>To:</b> bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Bldg-sim] Fwd: Re: Cost of climate file<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p>Yi,<o:p></o:p></p><p>I don't think Nathan was referring to climate.onebuilding.org when he questioned the value of free weather data on the Web. However, I think you're expressing a reverse bias (maybe I'm wrong) that the free stuff is more curated or quality controlled than the "commercial" stuff. The quality of anything on the Web, including weather data, should be judged on their own merits, not their source or origin. <o:p></o:p></p><p>I don't think of the "free" weather as free, but rather subsidized, mostly by the government. NREL did a fine job with the TMY2, TMY3, etc., but they had a rather large DOE contract to produce them. But after the project was done and problems were found, NREL admitted to them in 2009, but the fix was not made until six years later by an outside volunteer (me). I'm saying this not as criticism of NREL but to show that it's an imperfect world all around. <o:p></o:p></p><p>Joe<o:p></o:p></p><pre>Joe Huang<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>White Box Technologies, Inc.<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>346 Rheem Blvd., Suite 205A<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>Moraga CA 94556<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="mailto:yjhuang@whiteboxtechnologies.com">yjhuang@whiteboxtechnologies.com</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="http://weather.whiteboxtechnologies.com">http://weather.whiteboxtechnologies.com</a> for simulation-ready weather data<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>(o) (925)388-0265<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>(c) (510)928-2683<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>"building energy simulations at your fingertips"<o:p></o:p></pre><div><p class=MsoNormal>On 11/15/2016 3:54 AM, Dr Yi Zhang via Bldg-sim wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>Considering how much of the web nowadays is built upon "free stuff", it is very difficult to justify questioning the value of things you can get for free on the internet just because someone said "a very wise man once said so". Taking climate.onebuilding.org as an example, the arduous work Dru and Linda have put into collecting, processing and quality checking everything is truly amazing! If you have seen the folders still waiting to be processed in Dru's laptop, you will know what I am talking about.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>Yi</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'>Dr Yi Zhang, PhD CEng MCIBSE MASHRAE</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'>Director</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'>Energy Simulation Solutions Ltd. (UK)</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'>T: +44 (0)7809 572863</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'>E: <a href="mailto:yi.zhang@ensims.com"><span style='color:blue'>yi.zhang@ensims.com</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'>W: <a href="http://www.ensims.com"><span style='color:blue'>www.ensims.com</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext'> Bldg-sim [<a href="mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org">mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Nathan Kegel via Bldg-sim<br><b>Sent:</b> 14 November 2016 20:47<br><b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org">bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Bldg-sim] Fwd: Re: Cost of climate file</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'>It seems like this topic comes up on here nearly every week.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'>There are many sources of weather/climate data. Some free, some not. Some are very questionable in their accuracy, others are not.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'>As a very wise man once said, “Just because you can get something for free on the internet doesn’t mean it’s worth it”.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'>Can we create a mailing list rule that any time this topic comes up the server just automatically replies with a series of links about where you can get weather data? I’d be happy to work with everyone on this list to compile the links and put together the requisite disclaimers about knowing where the data comes from and ensuring you’ve analysed it to ensure its validity prior to using it.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'>In other words, haven’t we reached the point where weather/climate data ought to be a “sticky” at the top of the mailing list?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'>As far as sources go, IES have compiled (an incomplete) listing of both free and for-purchase sources of weather data. For those interested, here it is: </span><span lang=EN-GB><a href="http://www.iesve.com/support/weatherfiles">http://www.iesve.com/support/weatherfiles</a></span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-GB style='color:#1F497D'>Kind regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div></body></html>