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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-CA link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>In addition to the IEA and ASHRAE validation work already described there are also a bunch of CEN standards for energy simulation tools.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>One interesting development from a few years ago that may be of interest was that the actual models used for the validation tests for the ESP-r tool were embedded into the software (i.e. they are distributed with it and can be invoked by users from the interface). This gives the user two opportunities: they can check that they get the same answer on their OS/hardware and they can see how the ‘experts’ modelled the test cases. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Iain<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org [mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Dru Crawley<br><b>Sent:</b> January-23-12 7:37 PM<br><b>To:</b> bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Bldg-sim] Building envelope<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Std 140 comes with example results from various software programs. However many tools also publish reports comparing their 140 results on their web sites. That information is required to be certified as software for use for the tax credits for commercial buildings: <a href="http://www1.eere.energy.gov/buildings/tax_commercial.html">http://www1.eere.energy.gov/buildings/tax_commercial.html</a> and <a href="http://www1.eere.energy.gov/buildings/qualified_software.html">http://www1.eere.energy.gov/buildings/qualified_software.html</a><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 7:12 PM, RobertWichert <<a href="mailto:robert@wichert.org" target="_blank">robert@wichert.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Yes, good idea, Jeff. "Ease of use" isn't in there, but then, I guess that's not always important.<br><br>Do you know of any papers that compare EQuest to EnergyPro to EnergyPlus to DOE-2 to TRACE-700 to anything else using ASHRAE 140?<br><br>Maybe the publishers of these models have done the ASHRAE 140 work and would allow us to see it, but "Ease of Use" is not on their list!<br><br><br><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><pre>Robert Wichert P.Eng. LEED AP<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="tel:%2B1%20916%20966%209060" target="_blank">+1 916 966 9060</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre>FAX <a href="tel:%2B1%20916%20966%209068" target="_blank">+1 916 966 9068</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre>===============================================<o:p></o:p></pre><p class=MsoNormal><br>On 1/23/2012 3:13 PM, Jeff Haberl wrote: <o:p></o:p></p><div><p><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>FYI...<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>If you are thinking about how accurate an energy model may or may not be, there has been quite a bit of work done by the ASHRAE Standard 140 over the last 20 years, including: empirical, comparative and analytical models of the building envelope, air side systems. Standard 140 is a standard method of test for simulation that is used by others to see if the algorithms inside the program are performing correctly. The IEA and others have tests as well, which include side-by-side test boxes.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Jeff<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:blue'>8=! 8=) :=) 8=) ;=) 8=) 8=( 8=) 8=() 8=) 8=| 8=) :=') 8=)8=?<br><br>Jeff S. Haberl, Ph.D.,P.E., <a href="mailto:FASHRAE..............jhaberl@tamu.edu" target="_blank">FASHRAE..............jhaberl@tamu.edu</a><br><br>Professor............................................................Office Ph: <a href="tel:979-845-6507" target="_blank">979-845-6507</a><br><br>Department of Architecture.............................Lab Ph:<a href="tel:979-845-6065" target="_blank">979-845-6065</a><br><br>Energy Systems Laboratory.............................FAX: <a href="tel:979-862-2457" target="_blank">979-862-2457</a><br><br>Texas A&M University.....................................77843-3581<br><br>College Station, Texas, USA, 77843..................URL:<a href="http://www.esl.tamu.edu" target="_blank">www.esl.tamu.edu</a><br><br>8=/ 8=) :=) 8=) ;=) 8=) 8=() 8=) :=) 8=) 8=! 8=) 8=? 8=)8=0</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><hr size=2 width="100%" align=center></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><span style='font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>From:</span></b><span style='font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'> <a href="mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a> [<a href="mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>] on behalf of leen peeters [<a href="mailto:l.f.r.peeters@gmail.com" target="_blank">l.f.r.peeters@gmail.com</a>]<br><b>Sent:</b> Sunday, January 22, 2012 3:08 AM<br><b>To:</b> Jeremiah Crossett<br><b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org</a>; Jon Broadway<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Bldg-sim] Building envelope</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Jeremiah,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>it is already a pretty large building. I assume most people are like me ... really occupied. A small thing can be smached in between, but not something that might take me 6 to 8 hours to analyse and model. Should we not look for something smaller? A might be able to get some data on a passive house in Belgium. Something less than 200 m2, measured during over a year.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Leen<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Sat, Jan 21, 2012 at 9:47 PM, Jeremiah Crossett <<a href="mailto:jeremiah@setnrgh2o.com" target="_blank">jeremiah@setnrgh2o.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>I have two office buildings with data, including energy star portfolio manager data, and actual utility meeter data. Also I have architectural data on them. For the one I have three years data on, the other only one year. See the attached for the one with the best data and let me know if one of these works..<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Sat, Jan 21, 2012 at 11:00 AM, RobertWichert <<a href="mailto:robert@wichert.org" target="_blank">robert@wichert.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm'><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Now THAT would be a better test than I envisioned, Jon. I was just thinking of comparing models, NOT comparing them to a real building. Sounds like fun though! <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br><br><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><pre>Robert Wichert P.Eng. LEED AP<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="tel:%2B1%20916%20966%209060" target="_blank">+1 916 966 9060</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre>FAX <a href="tel:%2B1%20916%20966%209068" target="_blank">+1 916 966 9068</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre>===============================================<o:p></o:p></pre><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal>On 1/21/2012 9:15 AM, Jon Broadway wrote: <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Mr Wichert: And the next question would be , “Where do we find such an existing bldg. with real demand and energy data set already available?.” I would assume that many such exist, but I , for one, would not know how to begin to identify one. Maybe the folks at NREL or LNBL have access to such data, and maybe one from there could kindly respond to your request?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Jon A . Broadway</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm;border-color:currentColor currentColor'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> RobertWichert [<a href="mailto:robert@wichert.org" target="_blank">mailto:robert@wichert.org</a>] <br><b>Sent:</b> Friday, January 20, 2012 12:55 PM<br><b>To:</b> Jon Broadway; <a href="mailto:bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org</a></span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Bldg-sim] Building envelope<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Yes, of course. I was thinking of a non-residential one-story wood frame, steel studs, or concrete block building with one or two windows per side and a cathedral ceiling on a poured slab. A basement would be OK too, but not really necessary. Either no zoning at all or a core for toilets/break rooms and open plan office all around.<br><br>I mean REALLY simple.<br><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><pre>Robert Wichert P.Eng. LEED AP<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="tel:%2B1%20916%20966%209060" target="_blank">+1 916 966 9060</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre>FAX <a href="tel:%2B1%20916%20966%209068" target="_blank">+1 916 966 9068</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre> <o:p></o:p></pre><pre> <o:p></o:p></pre><pre> <o:p></o:p></pre><pre> <o:p></o:p></pre><pre> <o:p></o:p></pre><pre> <o:p></o:p></pre><pre> <o:p></o:p></pre><pre>===============================================<o:p></o:p></pre><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><br>On 1/20/2012 10:08 AM, Jon Broadway wrote: <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Mr Wichert: Although I like your idea of head-to-head modeling, I think it would only be real useful if one could start with a “simple” bldg. for wahich there was existing good quality energy and demand data set. That way, one could not only have “precision “ but also some baseline of “accuracy”.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I like you idea, but to start small and simple would be key for me, so as not to commit a large amount of time.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Thanks for your suggestion.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Jon Broadway</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Jon Broadway, Ph.D., P.E. </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Member, US Green Building Council</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Member, International Building Performance Standards Association (IBPSA)</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Energy Savers Unlimited</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>600 South Court St<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Suite 305<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Montgomery AL 36104<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Cell phone <a href="tel:334-%20430-0262" target="_blank">334- 430-0262</a><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><pre> <o:p></o:p></pre></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>_______________________________________________<br>Bldg-sim mailing list<br><a href="http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/bldg-sim-onebuilding.org" target="_blank">http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/bldg-sim-onebuilding.org</a><br>To unsubscribe from this mailing list send a blank message to <a href="mailto:BLDG-SIM-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG" target="_blank">BLDG-SIM-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG</a><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#888888'><br><br clear=all><o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#888888'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#888888'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#888888'>Jeremiah D. Crossett<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#888888'>Setanta Energy & Water<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#888888'>Phone: <a href="tel:503-688-8951" target="_blank">503-688-8951</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#888888'>Email: </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#888888'><a href="mailto:jeremiah@setnrgh2o.com" target="_blank"><span style='color:#0000CC'>jeremiah@setnrgh2o.com</span></a></span><span style='color:#888888'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#888888'><a href="http://www.setnrgh2o.com/" target="_blank">http://www.setnrgh2o.com/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='color:#888888'><br></span><br>_______________________________________________<br>Bldg-sim mailing list<br><a href="http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/bldg-sim-onebuilding.org" target="_blank">http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/bldg-sim-onebuilding.org</a><br>To unsubscribe from this mailing list send a blank message to <a href="mailto:BLDG-SIM-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG" target="_blank">BLDG-SIM-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG</a><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><pre>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>Bldg-sim mailing list<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/bldg-sim-onebuilding.org" target="_blank">http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/bldg-sim-onebuilding.org</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre>To unsubscribe from this mailing list send a blank message to <a href="mailto:BLDG-SIM-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG" target="_blank">BLDG-SIM-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG</a><o:p></o:p></pre></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>_______________________________________________<br>Bldg-sim mailing list<br><a href="http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/bldg-sim-onebuilding.org" target="_blank">http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/bldg-sim-onebuilding.org</a><br>To unsubscribe from this mailing list send a blank message to <a href="mailto:BLDG-SIM-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG" target="_blank">BLDG-SIM-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG</a><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></body></html>