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<div class=Section1>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Note that Table 6-1 has “—“ under the
CFM/person values for (“General”) corridors, storage spaces, electrical
rooms and similar spaces. I consider this ASHRAE’s indirect
guidance on spaces you can consider “typically unoccupied” (Pz = 0)
for the purposes of determining the minimum OA rate.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>~Nick<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><img width=119 height=37 id="Picture_x0020_1"
src="cid:image001.jpg@01CA63AA.1712AB10" alt="cid:489575314@22072009-0ABB"></span><b><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Stylus BT","sans-serif";color:#2D4D5E'><o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Stylus BT","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Stylus BT","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E'>NICK CATON, E.I.T.</span></b><b><span style='font-family:"Stylus BT","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E'><o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#CC9900'>PROJECT ENGINEER</span><span style='font-size:7.5pt;color:#CC9900'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E'>25501 west valley parkway<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E'>olathe ks 66061<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E'>direct 913 344.0036<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E'>fax 913 345.0617<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#2D4D5E'>Check out our new web-site @ </span></i><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><a
href="www.smithboucher.com" title="blocked::www.smithboucher.com"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>www.smithboucher.com</span></a></span><u><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:blue'> </span></u><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Karen Walkerman
[mailto:kwalkerman@gmail.com] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, November 12, 2009 2:34 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Nick Caton<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Brahme, Rohini UTRC; bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Bldg-sim] ASHRAE 62.1 unoccupied space minimum
outdoorairsupply<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Ok, this makes more
sense. What about corridors that have only transient and very low
occupancy rates? Can this also be classified as unoccupied?<br>
<br>
Thanks,<br>
<br>
--<br>
Karen<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal>On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 2:07 PM, Nick Caton <<a
href="mailto:ncaton@smithboucher.com">ncaton@smithboucher.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>I may be wrong, but it appears a number
of people aren’t examining the equation in 6.2.2.1 as I’m
suggesting. If you’ll check that out I’m certain you’ll
find this is a much simpler question/answer than it’s being made out to
be.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><u><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Both</span></u><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> sets of figures provided in Table 6-1 (OA/person and
OA/SF) are used to determine the design minimum OA rate, using 6.2.2.1’s
equation. Occupancy has no effect on the OA/SF requirement, and likewise
zonal area has no effect on the OA/person requirement. Additionally, the
occupancy figure used is the <u>maximum</u> occupancy of that zone.
Quoting <a href="http://6.2.2.1" target="_blank">6.2.2.1</a>:
“Pz = zone population: the largest number of people expected to occupy
the zone during typical usage…” It is not the hourly
percentage occupancy and is not zero unless the space is never normally
occupied (as with a storage room like Karen suggested).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>The design minimum OA rate is only
applicable when the ventilation system is operating. Unless I’m
missing something major, the ventilation system is not required by ASHRAE 62.1
to operate 24 hours per day (again, refer to Section 5.4, which
I’ve copied entirely below).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>I’ll try to break down the current
questions/statements on the table:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#003300'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#003300'>The reason I had the question was
because I think OA/sqft technically should not be dependent on occupancy…</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>That’s a fair judgement a designer
is allowed to make. The 62.1 Standard is just that – not a code,
but a set of suggestions provided by some of those best qualified to provide
them. To play the devil’s advocate, the counter-argument is that
Occupancy cannot be ignored by an energy-conscious ventilation system designer.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#003300'>…If that was the case, it would
suffice to just increase the OA/sqft and have only one number to take care of.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Someone doing that would be ignoring the
equation Table 6-1 was built around (re: 6.2.2.1). I’d agree that
would be a misinterpretation of the standard.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#003300'>What I am not sure of is whether OA/sqft
is used only during the typical occupied hours irrespective of whether it is
actually occupied or not or is it used throughtout the day/weekend/vacation
etc.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>OA/SF is always used alongside OA/person
to determine the “breathing zone outdoor airflow.” (Which
I’ve been calling the design minimum OA rate). The question of when
these ventilation rates apply is tied to when the zone is occupied. To
restate my position (Again Ref: Section 5.4): ASHRAE 62.1 does not
require that ventilation systems operate during unoccupied times.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#003300'>What do the hvac designers specify for
the control of OA?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Not sure whether a concise answer can be
provided to this broad question… OA ventilation <u>can</u> be controlled
by any combination of scheduling/occupancy sensing/timer
control/temperature/humidity/VOC, CO2, CO or other air quality sensors…
all depending on the project budget, climate, and type of system being
designed. If this question had a simple answer, then we wouldn’t
need HVAC designers =).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>what
happens when you have a space that is almost NEVER occupied, but has a cfm/sf
requirement - like a storage room with a requirement of 0.12 cfm/sf. <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>See my answer above.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>So
do you need this ventilation rate only when the building is occupied, only when
the space is occupied, or all the time?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Strictly speaking, only when the zone
(space) is occupied. If you have a one-zone system that doesn’t
distinguish between occupancy rates, then whenever the building is occupied.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>If
you only need the ventilation when the space is occupied, and it is almost
never occupied, why install the ventilation in the first place?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>This is a broad-scope question, so
I’ll add another quote under Section 1, entitled “PURPOSE:”</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
margin-left:.5in'><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>“1.1</span></b><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>
The purpose of this standard is to specify minimum ventilation rates and other
measures intended to provide indoor air quality that is acceptable to human
occupants ant that minimizes adverse health effects.”</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>If a space is never occupied, then
ASHRAE doesn’t care about air quality. If a space is “almost
never occupied,” then they do. To continue your example, if you
have a storage warehouse with no ventilation installed, and it’s almost
never occupied, someone might eventually store something in that space that
without ventilation would eventually cause a health hazard to the next occupant
entering the space. In my college years, this was a commonly observed
effect caused on a small scale by my roommates forgetting food in the microwave
=).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>~Nick</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>~Nick</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'><img border=0 width=119 height=37
id="_x0000_i1025" src="cid:image001.jpg@01CA63AA.1712AB10"
alt="cid:489575314@22072009-0ABB"></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'> </span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>NICK CATON, E.I.T.</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:7.5pt;color:#CC9900'>PROJECT ENGINEER</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>25501 west valley parkway</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>olathe ks 66061</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>direct 913 344.0036</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>fax 913 345.0617</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><i><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>Check out our new web-site @ </span></i><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'><a href="http://www.smithboucher.com"
target="_blank" title="blocked::www.smithboucher.com"><span style='font-size:
10.0pt'>www.smithboucher.com</span></a></span><u><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
color:blue'> </span></u><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in;
border-color:-moz-use-text-color -moz-use-text-color'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Karen
Walkerman [mailto:<a href="mailto:kwalkerman@gmail.com" target="_blank">kwalkerman@gmail.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, November 12, 2009 12:28 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Brahme, Rohini UTRC<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Nick Caton; <a href="mailto:bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org"
target="_blank">bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Bldg-sim] ASHRAE 62.1 unoccupied space minimum
outdoorairsupply<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Ok, so
here's a question - what happens when you have a space that is almost NEVER
occupied, but has a cfm/sf requirement - like a storage room with a requirement
of 0.12 cfm/sf. This is a pretty high outdoor airflow, especially if
you're just storing old files.<br>
<br>
So do you need this ventilation rate only when the building is occupied, only
when the space is occupied, or all the time?<br>
<br>
If you only need the ventilation when the space is occupied, and it is almost
never occupied, why install the ventilation in the first place?<br>
<br>
<br>
--<br>
Karen<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>On
Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 1:11 PM, Brahme, Rohini UTRC <<a
href="mailto:BrahmeR@utrc.utc.com" target="_blank">BrahmeR@utrc.utc.com</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#003300'>Thanks Nick. The reason I had the
question was because I think OA/sqft technically should not be dependent on
occupancy. If that was the case, it would suffice to just increase the OA/sqft
and have only one number to take care of. What I am not sure of is whether
OA/sqft is used only during the typical occupied hours irrespective of whether
it is actually occupied or not or is it used throughtout the
day/weekend/vacation etc. What do the hvac designers specify for the control of
OA?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#003300'>-rohini</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#003300'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in;
border-color:-moz-use-text-color'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Nick
Caton [mailto:<a href="mailto:ncaton@smithboucher.com" target="_blank">ncaton@smithboucher.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, November 12, 2009 12:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Brahme, Rohini UTRC; <a href="mailto:bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org"
target="_blank">bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [Bldg-sim] ASHRAE 62.1 unoccupied space minimum
outdoorairsupply</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#993366'>I havn’t read the standard in
detail, but isn’t there a requirement of some OA/sqft in addition to
OA/person. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>You are correct. Refer to the
equation of Section 6.2.2.1 as I referenced below.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#993366'>Let’s assume that an office is assumed
normally occupied from 8 am to 6 pm - Then during unoccupied hours (6.01
pm to 7.59 am) can the OA be zero or should it be OA per sqft?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>It sounds like you’re asking the
same question I just answered, so I may not be understanding
completely… By Section 5.4 I do not believe an unoccupied space is
required to have any OA supplied. The equation in 6.2.2.1 does include a
component “per square foot,” but that equation is for determining
the design minimum OA rate.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#993366'>More tricky, let’s say we have a occupancy
sensor and know that the office is unoccupied from 12.00 pm to 3 pm (during the
regular office times). What is the OA at this time – 0 or OA/sqft?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Applying the same logic and the same
section, 5.4, if there are controls that automatically determine a space is
occupied and turn the associated system on to provide the required OA, then
there’s no reason those systems aren’t allowed to turn off while
unoccupied. Short answer for your example: 0.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>I’ll point out, I’m merely
an E.I.T. (with my head in the books) sharing my interpretations, so it may be
worth holding out for a second opinion =).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>~Nick</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'><img border=0 width=119 height=37
id="_x0000_i1026" src="cid:image001.jpg@01CA63AA.1712AB10"
alt="cid:489575314@22072009-0ABB"></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'> </span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>NICK CATON, E.I.T.</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:7.5pt;color:#CC9900'>PROJECT ENGINEER</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>25501 west valley parkway</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>olathe ks 66061</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>direct 913 344.0036</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>fax 913 345.0617</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><i><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>Check out our new web-site @ </span></i><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'><a href="http://www.smithboucher.com"
target="_blank" title="blocked::www.smithboucher.com"><span style='font-size:
10.0pt'>www.smithboucher.com</span></a></span><u><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
color:blue'> </span></u><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in;
border-color:-moz-use-text-color'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <a
href="mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>
[mailto:<a href="mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Brahme, Rohini UTRC<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, November 12, 2009 11:14 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Bldg-sim] ASHRAE 62.1 unoccupied space minimum
outdoorairsupply</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#993366'>Since we are on this topic, I had a
question on definition of occupancy.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#993366'>I havn’t read the standard in
detail, but isn’t there a requirement of some OA/sqft in addition to
OA/person. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#993366'>Let’s assume that an office is
assumed normally occupied from 8 am to 6 pm - Then during unoccupied
hours (6.01 pm to 7.59 am) can the OA be zero or should it be OA per sqft?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#993366'>More tricky, let’s say we have a
occupancy sensor and know that the office is unoccupied from 12.00 pm to 3 pm
(during the regular office times). What is the OA at this time – 0 or
OA/sqft?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#993366'>Thanks</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#993366'>-rohini</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#993366'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in;
border-color:-moz-use-text-color'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <a
href="mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>
[mailto:<a href="mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Nick Caton<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, November 12, 2009 11:36 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Guin, Michael; <a href="mailto:bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org"
target="_blank">bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Bldg-sim] ASHRAE 62.1 unoccupied space minimum
outdoorairsupply</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>No.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Refer to Section 5.4: </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>“Mechanical
ventilation systems shall include controls, manual or automatic, that enable
the fan system to operate whenever <u>the spaces served are occupied</u>.
The system shall be designed to maintain the minimum outdoor airflow as
required by Section 6 <u>under any load condition</u>.” </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>In summary, you must provided the
minimum ventilation rate as prescribed in Chapter 6 only when (A) the space is
occupied and (B) there’s a thermal load condition (or manual control
– see Section 5.4) triggering the operation of the ventilation system.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Your original question is confusing to
at least a few of us because of stating an office ceases to be a
“zone” at night… It’s a terminology thing, but
62.1 and other standards will become more digestible to you when you recognize
that’s not the case. The clarification we’re making here is
that where a zone occupancy (i.e. “office”) is decided and a constant
over time, something like “occupancy rate” can be variable.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>I’d like to also point out, based
on your first inquiry, that the equation at 6.2.2.1 uses <u>maximum</u> zone
occupancy to establish the minimum design OA rate, not the hourly occupancy
rate (which may be zero).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>~Nick</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'><img border=0 width=119 height=37
id="_x0000_i1027" src="cid:image001.jpg@01CA63AA.1712AB10"
alt="cid:489575314@22072009-0ABB"></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'> </span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>NICK CATON, E.I.T.</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:7.5pt;color:#CC9900'>PROJECT ENGINEER</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>25501 west valley parkway</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>olathe ks 66061</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>direct 913 344.0036</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>fax 913 345.0617</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><i><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;color:#2D4D5E'>Check out our new web-site @ </span></i><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'><a href="http://www.smithboucher.com"
target="_blank" title="blocked::www.smithboucher.com"><span style='font-size:
10.0pt'>www.smithboucher.com</span></a></span><u><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
color:blue'> </span></u><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid windowtext 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in;
border-color:-moz-use-text-color'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <a
href="mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>
[mailto:<a href="mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Guin, Michael<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, November 12, 2009 8:44 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:Shawn.Lee@fluor.com" target="_blank">Shawn.Lee@fluor.com</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org"
target="_blank">bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a>; <a
href="mailto:bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Bldg-sim] ASHRAE 62.1 unoccupied space minimum outdoor
airsupply</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>is there any requirement to provide
minimum outdoor fresh air wihin the office space when it is unoccupied
according to ASHRAE 62.1</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Do you think it it clear enough? </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Regards</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Michael</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <a
href="mailto:Shawn.Lee@fluor.com" target="_blank">Shawn.Lee@fluor.com</a>
[mailto:<a href="mailto:Shawn.Lee@fluor.com" target="_blank">Shawn.Lee@fluor.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 12 November 2009 13:58<br>
<b>To:</b> Guin, Michael<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org</a>;
<a href="mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Bldg-sim] ASHRAE 62.1 unoccupied space minimum outdoor air
supply</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>
<span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Michael,</span> <br>
<br>
<span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Technically answering your question may not help
you much. You need to make the question clearer and more meaningful.
Tell people what you are trying to do, what is in your mind, and what you
are trying to accomplish. Then this group may help you more on the
target.</span> <br>
<br>
<span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Thanks.</span> <br>
<br>
<span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Shawn Lee, PhD, PE</span> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:7.5pt'>"Guin, Michael"
<Michael.Guin@WSPGroup.com></span></b> <br>
<span style='font-size:7.5pt'>Sent by: <a
href="mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</a></span>
<br>
<span style='font-size:7.5pt'>11/12/2009 06:09 AM</span> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal align=right style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
auto;text-align:right'><span style='font-size:7.5pt'>To</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
auto'><span style='font-size:7.5pt'><<a
href="mailto:bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org" target="_blank">bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org</a>></span>
<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal align=right style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
auto;text-align:right'><span style='font-size:7.5pt'>cc</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal align=right style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
auto;text-align:right'><span style='font-size:7.5pt'>Subject</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:
auto'><span style='font-size:7.5pt'>[Bldg-sim] ASHRAE 62.1 unoccupied space
minimum outdoor air supply</span> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Dear all,</span> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>ASHARE 62.1 2007 deifned zone as an occupied space.
Table 6-1 provides the calculation for different spaces based on occupancy and
floor area of the occupied space.</span> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>If we consider an unoccupied office space at
night (i.e. not strictly a "zone anymore" ); is there any requirement
to provide minimum fresh air wihin the office space. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Thanks in advance for your help</span> <span
style='font-size:10.0pt'><br>
Michael </span> <o:p></o:p></p>
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