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<DIV dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
class=898481008-22042009>You may also be interested in the work reported in an
ASHRAE paper that appeared at the last Chicago meeting:</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
class=898481008-22042009></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
class=898481008-22042009>"Predicting Local Thermal Discomfort Adjacent
to<BR>Glazing (NY-08-053)<BR>Simon J. Rees, Ph.D., Member, Kevin J. Lomas, Ph.D.
and<BR>Dusan Fiala, De Montfort University, Leicester,
UK<BR></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
class=898481008-22042009>In this work a multi-segment dynamic comfort model
has<BR>been employed that incorporates recently developed models<BR>of local
thermal comfort response. The work required the<BR>development of simulation
methods able to predict the detailed<BR>long-wave and convective exchanges to
the surrounding<BR>space and the absorbed solar irradiation. This has been
done<BR>in an effi cient and generic manner so that parametric studies<BR>of
local comfort responses have been possible. Such studies</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>have been used to examine the relationships between
local<BR>discomfort and room and window temperatures as well as the<BR>role
solar irradiation and clothing may play in determining<BR>satisfactory winter
environmental conditions."</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2><FONT face=Arial>T<SPAN class=898481008-22042009>he main
points to note are that the model uses a local rather than global comfort model
i.e. effects on particular body parts are considered. Direct solar radiation and
shading of particular body parts are calculated. View factors for each body part
are calculated for a particular body position relative to the room rather than
calculating the MRT.</SPAN></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
class=898481008-22042009></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
class=898481008-22042009>Regards,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
class=898481008-22042009>Simon</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left>
<HR tabIndex=-1>
<FONT face=Tahoma size=2><B>From:</B> bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Timothy
Moore<BR><B>Sent:</B> 22 April 2009 04:19<BR><B>To:</B> JRR; Peter
Simmonds<BR><B>Cc:</B> bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org; Vikram
Sami<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Bldg-sim] MRT Tool<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=Section1>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Regarding
<B>asymmetrical thermal comfort and that involving transmitted short-wave
radiation</B>, the following link will get you an excellent (lengthy, detailed,
and very helpful) paper on thermal comfort in proximity to windows. It discusses
the effects of glass surface temperatures and transmission properties, along
with possible options for including a rating of thermal comfort performance on
NFRC window labeling.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Huizenga,
C., H. Zhang, P. Mattelaer, T. Yu, E. Arens, and P. Lyons, 2006. <A
href="http://www.cbe.berkeley.edu/research/pdf_files/SR_NFRC2006_FinalReport.pdf">Window
Performance for Human Thermal Comfort</A>. Final Report to the National
Fenestration Rating Council, Center for the Built Environment, University of
California, Berkeley, February.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">You
do not need an open window to have comfort issues associated with transmitted
short-wave radiation, nor does it have to be direct-beam radiation—any window
permitting occupants to receive a good dose of transmitted diffuse and/or direct
solar radiation is reason enough to care about this effect. The paper at the CBE
link above provides a very useful means of estimating the contribution of both
direct-beam and diffuse solar radiation. The discussion of the impact of diffuse
radiation begins on page 44 and the discussion of direct radiation starts on
page 49.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"><A
href="http://www.cbe.berkeley.edu/research/briefs-thermmodel.htm"><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: normal">CBE’s Advanced Thermal Comfort Model
</SPAN></A></SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">This
tool can used to study the effectiveness of energy saving design strategies,
such as facade designs and advanced HVAC systems, in terms of occupant comfort.
<BR><BR><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">In
addition, the CBE has an Advanced Thermal Comfort model that they will be happy
to run for you as consultants to your project (and which their industry partners
also have direct access to) which takes into account short-wave radiation
striking a human subject, along with numerous very detailed thermal comfort
parameters. This tool was used for several key sections of the paper linked
above, so you can see examples of the model and results there. Not only does
this model account for occupant attributes like body mass (along with the usual
comfort parameters), it actually models 16 different human body parts and the
constriction and dilation of blood vessels that accompanies different
thermo-physiological states. This model, which is not really all that difficult
to work with, has been used for CBE consulting to the automotive industry and a
in-house by handful of large A&E firms. If you want to learn more, the
following link takes you to the section of the CBE web site describing this
tool:<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Cheers,<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Timothy<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
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style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">
JRR [mailto:energy.wwind@cox.net] <BR><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, April 21, 2009 7:44
PM<BR><B>To:</B> Peter Simmonds<BR><B>Cc:</B> Vikram Sami; Timothy Moore; Karen
Walkerman; bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Bldg-sim] MRT
Tool<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal>JRR wrote;<BR><BR>Good Point !! Do you take the
radiation temperature at the virtual surface of the open window ??<BR>NO.
It is the wrong answer, but now you need to know things like the RT of an
adjacent building,<BR>background sky RT, luminosity...<BR><BR>Peter Simmonds
wrote: <o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Ah,
another can of worms. MRT is probably the least understood and certainly the
least calculated of space thermodynamics. ASHRAE RP 1383 was specifically set up
to calculate MRT for spaces, even having unusual configurations. It should be
ready in about 18 months or so? </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">So
Vikram, with reference to your analogy, how about this
one?</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Imagine
a space that is naturally ventilated through an open window, at this certain
time of the day the occupant is in such a position that the suns rays reach the
occupant through the open window. What would the MRT be in the space and how
would this affect the occupants comfort.</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Peter Simmonds.
Ph.D.</SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"><BR>Senior
Associate, Advanced Technology Group<BR><BR></SPAN><SPAN
style="COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">IBE Consulting
Engineers</SPAN><SPAN style="COLOR: gray"><BR></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">14130
Riverside Drive Suite 201</SPAN><SPAN
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style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Sherman
Oaks, CA 91423<BR>p: (818) 377-8220 ext. 246<BR>f:
(818) 377-8230<BR>m: (818) 219-1284</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
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<HR align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'"> Vikram Sami [<A
href="mailto:VSami@lasarchitect.com">mailto:VSami@lasarchitect.com</A>]
<BR><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, April 21, 2009 12:02 PM<BR><B>To:</B> Peter Simmonds;
Timothy Moore; Karen Walkerman; <A
href="mailto:bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org">bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org</A><BR><B>Subject:</B>
RE: [Bldg-sim] MRT Tool</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #0025c4; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">It’s
an interesting conundrum that the times that MRT becomes a significant player in
the comfort calculation is when there is an uneven radiant field (hot or cold
window; fireplace; thermal mass wall). In such a situation, is it fair to
average out the MRT for an entire room? Don’t your view factors change
drastically depending on your position in the room? </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #0025c4; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #0025c4; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Does
one person too hot near the window and another person too cold on the inside
equal thermal comfort? </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #0025c4; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Garamond','serif'">Vikram
Sami,</SPAN></B><SPAN style="COLOR: #0025c4"> </SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Garamond','serif'">LEED AP</SPAN><SPAN
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<DIV>
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<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'"> <A
href="mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org">bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</A>
[<A
href="mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org">mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</A>]
<B>On Behalf Of </B>Peter Simmonds<BR><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, April 21, 2009 1:36
PM<BR><B>To:</B> Timothy Moore; Karen Walkerman; <A
href="mailto:bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org">bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org</A><BR><B>Subject:</B>
Re: [Bldg-sim] MRT Tool</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">I do not
think the thermal comfort tool calculates the MRT it is a user
input.</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Peter Simmonds.
Ph.D.</SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"><BR>Senior
Associate, Advanced Technology Group<BR><BR></SPAN><SPAN
style="COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">IBE Consulting
Engineers</SPAN><SPAN style="COLOR: gray"><BR></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">14130
Riverside Drive Suite 201</SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"><BR></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Sherman
Oaks, CA 91423<BR>p: (818) 377-8220 ext. 246<BR>f:
(818) 377-8230<BR>m: (818) 219-1284</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
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<HR align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'"> Timothy Moore [<A
href="mailto:timothy.moore@iesve.com">mailto:timothy.moore@iesve.com</A>]
<BR><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, April 21, 2009 10:00 AM<BR><B>To:</B> Karen Walkerman;
<A
href="mailto:bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org">bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org</A><BR><B>Subject:</B>
Re: [Bldg-sim] MRT Tool</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Karen,</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">The
ASHRAE-55 Thermal Comfort Tool created by the UC Berkeley Center for the Built
Environment and available from ASHRAE publications (if I recall correctly)
includes a very easy-to-use MRT calculator for rectangular rooms. It allows for
MRT at a particular position in that room, separate surface temperatures and
dimensions for surfaces, and also the inclusion of a “panel” or other area
within one of the walls (such as a cold/hot window, heating panel, etc.) that
has a distinct temperature. This is part of a very handy tool for determining
PPD, etc. based upon the typical range of human thermal comfort variables (clo
value, activity level, air temp, MRT, humidity, air
movement).</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Cheers,</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
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<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'"> <A
href="mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org">bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</A>
[<A
href="mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org">mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org</A>]
<B>On Behalf Of </B>Karen Walkerman<BR><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, April 21, 2009 9:50
AM<BR><B>To:</B> <A
href="mailto:bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org">bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org</A><BR><B>Subject:</B>
[Bldg-sim] MRT Tool</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal>Hello,<BR><BR>Is anyone aware of a simple Mean Radiant
Temperature calculation tool? I'm looking for something that will
calculate MRT for a basic rectangular
room.<BR><BR>Thanks!<BR><BR>--<BR>Karen<o:p></o:p></P><PRE><o:p> </o:p></PRE><PRE style="TEXT-ALIGN: center">
<HR align=center width="90%" SIZE=4>
</PRE><PRE><o:p> </o:p></PRE><PRE>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>Bldg-sim mailing list<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE><A href="http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/bldg-sim-onebuilding.org">http://lists.onebuilding.org/listinfo.cgi/bldg-sim-onebuilding.org</A><o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>To unsubscribe from this mailing list send a blank message to <A href="mailto:BLDG-SIM-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG">BLDG-SIM-UNSUBSCRIBE@ONEBUILDING.ORG</A><o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE> <o:p></o:p></PRE></DIV></BODY></HTML>