<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:x="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:excel" xmlns:p="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:powerpoint" xmlns:a="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:access" xmlns:dt="uuid:C2F41010-65B3-11d1-A29F-00AA00C14882" xmlns:s="uuid:BDC6E3F0-6DA3-11d1-A2A3-00AA00C14882" xmlns:rs="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:rowset" xmlns:z="#RowsetSchema" xmlns:b="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:publisher" xmlns:ss="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:spreadsheet" xmlns:c="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:component:spreadsheet" xmlns:odc="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:odc" xmlns:oa="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:activation" xmlns:html="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40" xmlns:q="http://schemas.xmlsoap.org/soap/envelope/" xmlns:D="DAV:" xmlns:mt="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/soap/meetings/" xmlns:x2="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/excel/2003/xml" xmlns:ois="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/soap/ois/" xmlns:dir="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/soap/directory/" xmlns:ds="http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmldsig#" xmlns:dsp="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/dsp" xmlns:udc="http://schemas.microsoft.com/data/udc" xmlns:xsd="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema" xmlns:sub="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/soap/2002/1/alerts/" xmlns:ec="http://www.w3.org/2001/04/xmlenc#" xmlns:sp="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/" xmlns:sps="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/soap/" xmlns:xsi="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance" xmlns:udcs="http://schemas.microsoft.com/data/udc/soap" xmlns:udcxf="http://schemas.microsoft.com/data/udc/xmlfile" xmlns:udcp2p="http://schemas.microsoft.com/data/udc/parttopart" xmlns:wf="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/soap/workflow/" xmlns:dsss="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2006/digsig-setup" xmlns:dssi="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2006/digsig" xmlns:mdssi="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/package/2006/digital-signature" xmlns:mver="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/markup-compatibility/2006" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns:mrels="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/package/2006/relationships" xmlns:spwp="http://microsoft.com/sharepoint/webpartpages" xmlns:ex12t="http://schemas.microsoft.com/exchange/services/2006/types" xmlns:ex12m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/exchange/services/2006/messages" xmlns:pptsl="http://schemas.microsoft.com/sharepoint/soap/SlideLibrary/" xmlns:spsl="http://microsoft.com/webservices/SharePointPortalServer/PublishedLinksService" xmlns:Z="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:" xmlns:st="" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
<head>
<META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; charset=us-ascii">
<meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 12 (filtered medium)">
<!--[if !mso]>
<style>
v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
</style>
<![endif]-->
<style>
<!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:Wingdings;
panose-1:5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Tahoma;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Complex;
panose-1:0 0 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:purple;
text-decoration:underline;}
p
{mso-style-priority:99;
mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
margin-right:0in;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
margin-left:0in;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";}
span.EmailStyle18
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle19
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:navy;}
span.apple-style-span
{mso-style-name:apple-style-span;}
span.EmailStyle22
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D;}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
font-size:10.0pt;}
@page Section1
{size:8.5in 11.0in;
margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in;}
div.Section1
{page:Section1;}
-->
</style>
<!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
<o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]-->
</head>
<body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple>
<div class=Section1>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>From what I know IES-VE is really not an ideal tool if you want
to submit for LEED EAc1. From my understanding you cannot model a chilled
water plant in IES-VE. Has anyone submitted their energy model for LEED EAc1?
If so how was your experience? What type of system did you model? Our company
is looking into this program but this limitations is a HUGE factor in our
decision.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:gray'>ARTURO HERNANDEZ, LEED AP<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Field,
Kristin<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 12, 2009 5:19 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Bldg-sim] One model<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:navy'>According to another Bldg-Sim member, my statement of basic HVAC
calculations could be misleading, so I will clarify in case it bothered anyone
else. If one would describe natural ventilation as an HVAC calculation,
then I would *<b>not</b>* describe IES-VE as “basic” in that context.
That capability seemed very strong to me in IES-VE. However, if you want
to model sophisticated HVAC *<b>mechanical</b>* equipment (yes, this could be a
gray area since HVAC can integrate with NV via controls on the windows, so
suffice it to say that I’m talking about all HVAC *<b>except</b>* NV and didn’t
come up with a more bulletproof term), then it does not have as wide an array
of options as DOE2 and EnergyPlus. I thought I stated that below in the
fourth sentence, but maybe it gets confusing along the way. This is as of
several months ago, and I didn’t check out a new version and do a thorough
review just to write this email. So if a bunch of new HVAC capabilities
have been added, then that could date some of my statements. Apologies to
anyone who thought I was trying to trash IES-VE because I definitely did not
intend to do that. I think it’s an impressive program and probably useful
to a lot of people.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:navy'>Kristin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>
bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org [mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Field, Kristin<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 12, 2009 2:40 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Bldg-sim] One model</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:navy'>I tried out IES-VE a few months or a year ago with some people
because the potential for this type of integration seemed very exciting.
However, we found the HVAC side to be pretty basic. For a lot of building
types, there are significant savings to be had by changing HVAC control schemes
and/or configurations and using HVAC types that were not well-represented in
IES-VE the last time I saw it. It seemed like a great interface to use if
you were trying to design a building to use minimal energy due to envelope,
orientation, natural ventilation, etc. In other words, it seems strong on
the loads calculation side. On the system use side, though, it seemed a
lot more limited than DOE2 or EnergyPlus. For that reason, I have also
stuck with the multiple-tools method. I agree with all who wrote that it
would be wonderful to have one integrated tool in the future! Rob does
bring up an interesting point about the resolution of spaces needed for
daylighting vs. thermal vs. architectural modeling. Architects especially
have to be so detailed in their models that I’ve often just ended up using the
floor plans they provided, deleting a bunch of elements out of those, and
scaling wall heights and windows. Other than that, their 3D models only
serve to help me visualize the building myself. It would be nice if we
didn’t end up tripling the effort like we all do now, but so far I don’t see a
great way around it (unless you don’t need complex system modeling – then you
could use IES-VE as discussed below).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:navy'>Kristin Field<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>
bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>CARNEY
Ronan<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, March 11, 2009 10:34 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Rob Guglielmetti; Ross Harding<br>
<b>Cc:</b> bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Bldg-sim] One model</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:blue'>Actually, I'm utilising IES to do HVAC design, Energy Analysis, PMV
calc, lighting lux design, lighting power intensity design and natural daylight
analysis all in line with the Australian Standards and Green Star (another form
of LEED) requirements. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:blue'>Although the software costs money, I've found it to be worthwhile
battling against it's flaws and it gives us the results which we require. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><strong><u><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:blue'>Please note, this is a one model approach</span></u></strong><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'>. It's
easy to start a project at CD (concept design) stage within Google Sketchup and
to utilise the freeware version of IES to do alternate design analysis.
However, it's way better if the full suite is purchases and the model is
crossed over into IES. Within IES multiple analysis and detailed designs can be
modelled quickly and with fantastic final project results. I know, I've done
it.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:blue'>Also with the daylight analysis, if you've got a detailed building
with over 100000 surfaces, it's going to take forever to do the analysis,
that's my only issue with the software. However, the software is developing
multithreading facility within it's software, therefore decreasing the time for
analysis dramatically.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:blue'>Should anyone want to discuss my approaches further, and are in
Brisbane, I welcome the opportunity to meet and greet with you.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;color:navy'>Regards,</span></i></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'><br>
<b><i>Ronan Carney</i></b><br>
</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Complex'>Electrical Engineer</span><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'><br>
</span><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:maroon'>Project Services</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><br>
</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:blue'>*</span><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:purple'>Level 5B
80 George St</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> </span><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:purple'>Brisbane</span><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'><br>
</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:blue'>(</span><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Ph:</span><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif"'>(07) 3224 5983</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><br>
</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:blue'>2</span><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Fax: (07) 3224 6151</span><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'><br>
</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:blue'>,</span><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Email<span
style='color:blue'>:</span></span><u><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> </span></u><a
href="mailto:Ronan.Carney@projectservices.qld.gov.au"
title="mailto:Ronan.Carney@projectservices.qld.gov.au"><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Ronan.Carney@projectservices.qld.gov.au</span></a>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:bldg-sim-bounces@lists.onebuilding.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Rob
Guglielmetti<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, 12 March 2009 1:12 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Ross Harding<br>
<b>Cc:</b> bldg-sim@lists.onebuilding.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Bldg-sim] One model</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal>On Mar 11, 2009, at 6:09 PM, Ross Harding wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span class=apple-style-span><span lang=EN-AU
style='font-size:9.0pt;color:#144FAE'>The ultimate goal for us would be to use
one model for daylight and energy models, but I haven’t found that quite that
simple as most software requires varying drawing techniques.</span></span><span
class=apple-style-span><span lang=EN-AU style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal>Amen brother! Another issue is that while the energy
model has to include the total building -- all spaces and systems -- to be a
complete picture of the energy use, a Radiance-based daylight model does not
necessarily require all the spaces to be modeled simultaneously. Indeed,
the accuracy of the ambient calculation is directly affected by the maximum
size of the scene, and so conducting a simultaneous daylight simulation of an entire
building at an acceptably rigorous ambient resolution can be -- is generally --
time-prohibitive.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal>As mentioned in a recent thread on this list, Thomas
Bleicher's "su2rad" plugin for SketchUp can export a SU model to
Radiance format and there is also an E+ plugin to allow one to use the same SU
model for E+ analysis; in theory, these three components (SketchUp, su2rad and
the E+ plugin) allow for a "single model" approach to energy and
daylight modeling. However, because the su2rad exporter wants to take the
entire model and create a single Radiance scene description, that creates the
aforementioned problem of the ambient calculation getting out of hand fairly
quickly. I suppose through intelligent layering and model structuring,
one could create a model that could be exported to Radiance in "space
components", but I'm not sure if this is compatible with the E+ plugin's
layering/model organization requirements.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal>- Rob Guglielmetti<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>********************************************************</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Kristin
M. Field</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Engineer
II - Mechanical</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Electricity,
Resources & Building Systems Integration</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>National
Renewable Energy Laboratory</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>1617
Cole Blvd.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Mail
Stop #1725</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Golden,
CO 80401</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Phone:
303.384.7376</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Fax:
303.384.7540</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
</body>
</html>