That would be great if you could report back following the USGBC audit.<br><br>
<div><span class="gmail_quote">On 11/17/07, <b class="gmail_sendername">Zarske, Jim</b> <<a href="mailto:jzarske@nexant.com">jzarske@nexant.com</a>> wrote:</span>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">
<div><span class="q">
<div dir="ltr" align="left"><span><font face="Arial" color="#0000ff" size="2">We just completed a project with KONE's high efficiency elevator system. We assumed hydraulic to be the baseline, and the KONE traction elevators to be the EEM. KONE has their own software where they ran the analysis for us for both system types. They provided the baseline and EEM energy usuage (kW) of both elevator systems. We plugged these values into eQUEST as a direct load to the electric utility meter and used the elevator default schedule in the eQUEST library.
</font></span></div>
<div dir="ltr" align="left"><span><font face="Arial" color="#0000ff" size="2"></font></span> </div>
<div dir="ltr" align="left"><span><font face="Arial" color="#0000ff" size="2">This project is going for LEED and we'll see if this methodology works for USGBC. </font></span></div>
<div dir="ltr" align="left"><span><font face="Arial" color="#0000ff" size="2"></font></span> </div>
<div dir="ltr" align="left"><span>
<div align="left"><font face="Arial" size="2">James Zarske, PE, CEM, LEED AP<br>Nexant, Inc.<br><a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="http://www.nexant.com/" target="_blank">www.nexant.com</a><br>
Direct: 303.402.2497<br>Fax: 303.440.6644</font></div></span></div><br></span>
<div lang="en-us" dir="ltr" align="left">
<hr>
<font face="Tahoma" size="2"><b>From:</b> <a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:BLDG-SIM@gard.com" target="_blank">BLDG-SIM@gard.com</a> [mailto:<a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:BLDG-SIM@gard.com" target="_blank">
BLDG-SIM@gard.com</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Erik Dyrr<br><b>Sent:</b> Friday, November 16, 2007 11:06 PM<span class="q"><br><b>To:</b> <a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:BLDG-SIM@gard.com" target="_blank">
BLDG-SIM@gard.com</a><br></span><b>Cc:</b> <a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:BLDG-SIM@gard.com" target="_blank">BLDG-SIM@gard.com</a><span class="q"><br><b>Subject:</b> [BLDG-SIM] Traction Elevators and LEED Baseline
<br></span></font><br> </div><span class="q">
<div></div>
<div>I was also just in the process of developing a calculation. I sent an email to Otis Elevator inquiring if they had worked through this already, but recieved no reply. There is an interesting ACEEE paper on elevator energy consumption and efficiency at h
<a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="http://www.aceee.org/buildings/coml_equp/elevators.pdf" target="_blank">ttp://www.aceee.org/buildings/coml_equp/elevators.pdf</a></div>
<div>I would be interested to see how anyone has calculated savings or collaboration if you are working through it now.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Erik Dyrr</div>
<div>KEMA</div>
<div><br><br> </div></span>
<div><span class="q"><span class="gmail_quote">On 11/16/07, <b class="gmail_sendername">Miller, Nathan</b> <<a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:nathan.miller@stantec.com" target="_blank">
nathan.miller@stantec.com</a>> wrote:</span> </span>
<div><span class="e" id="q_1164f38cab01cbf7_10">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">I have submitted a LEED-CS v2.0 project for review where we took credit<br>for elevator efficiency (I haven't received any comments back yet, so I
<br>don't know if they will go for it). That being said, I also review LEED<br>EAc1 submissions, on behalf of the USGBC, and would likely allow such an<br>ECM as long as the calculation methodology was clearly laid out and well
<br>supported.<br><br>I used manufacturer data (horsepower ratings) for the traction elevator<br>and compared to a "typical" hydraulic elevator. I couldn't find any<br>reputable source to create a partial load schedule for the motor, so I
<br>applied the appropriate elevator schedule (in this case it was an<br>office) from the schedule tables that can be found at the end of the<br>Appendix G section of the ASHRAE 90.1-2004 User's Manual. I also put the
<br>elevators on their own electric meter so that I could easily sort out<br>that data. It certainly isn't a highly-refined calculation, but<br>shouldn't be any worse than the estimate you would have to make to<br>
account for elevator energy in the first place.<br><br>I've heard there are some programs that specifically model elevator<br>systems (more for optimizing usage than energy), but I haven't used any<br>of them. Anybody know if these are a more accurate way to estimate
<br>elevator energy usage?<br><br>I would also recommend reading some of the papers published by Lutfi<br>Al-Sharif (an engineer or professor from the UK, I believe), who is one<br>of the foremost experts in elevator energy usage, as far as I can tell.
<br><br>Nathan Miller<br>Mechanical Engineer<br>Stantec<br><br>-----Original Message-----<br>From: <a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:BLDG-SIM@gard.com" target="_blank">BLDG-SIM@gard.com
</a> [mailto:<a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:BLDG-SIM@gard.com" target="_blank">BLDG-SIM@gard.com</a>] On Behalf Of Jon <br>Evans<br>Sent: Friday, November 16, 2007 3:13 PM<br>To: <a onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:BLDG-SIM@gard.com" target="_blank">
BLDG-SIM@gard.com</a><br>Subject: [BLDG-SIM] Traction Elevators and LEED Baseline<br><br>Does anyone have experience using the exceptional calculation method <br>(ASHRAE<br>90.1 Appendix G Section G2.5) to justify traction elevators as an
<br>efficiency improvement over hydraulic elevators?<br><br>I searched the LEED CIR rulings and didn't find much on the exceptional<br>calculation method or changing the process load for elevator upgrades. <br>(Appendix G Table
G3.1 line 12 says that the elevator load must stay the<br>same).<br><br>Thanks!<br><br>-Jon<br><br><br>======================================================<br>You received this e-mail because you are subscribed to the <br>
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