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<DIV><SPAN class=266220214-07082007><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT
size=2><SPAN class=865222114-07082007><SPAN
class=921581821-15082007>Brandon</SPAN></SPAN>:</FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=266220214-07082007></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><SPAN class=266220214-07082007><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT
size=2><SPAN class=921581821-15082007>As promised, I post following instruction
for obtaining the heat pump library</SPAN>.
</FONT></FONT></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><SPAN class=266220214-07082007><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT
size=2></FONT></FONT></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT><SPAN class=266220214-07082007><FONT><FONT face=Arial><FONT
color=#0000ff><FONT size=2><SPAN class=921581821-15082007>The heat pump library
and other associated files for eQUEST to access the library are packaged in a
self-extracted zip file, which </SPAN>can be downloaded at
</FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN><A
href="http://www.climatemaster.com/index/equest"><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2>http://www.climatemaster.com/index/equest</FONT></A><FONT
face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT size=2> <SPAN
class=266220214-07082007>after proper registration.<SPAN
class=921581821-15082007> In addition to the heat pump library, the standard
release of eQUEST 3.6 and an eQUEST training handout focused on the enhanced
GSHP simulation and the heat pump library can also to downloaded. In order
to access the heat pump library directly from eQUEST wizard, the
self-extracted zip file has to be unzipped over the installation of eQUEST. The
instruction for unzipping the file is shown in the above web page. The procedure
for selecting a heat pump from the library is described in slides 77-84 of the
training handout. </SPAN></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT size=2><SPAN
class=266220214-07082007><SPAN
class=921581821-15082007></SPAN></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT size=2><SPAN
class=266220214-07082007><SPAN class=921581821-15082007>As an add-on
feature, the heat pump library can be accessed by eQUEST starting from version
3.6. </SPAN></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT><FONT><FONT
face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT size=2><SPAN class=266220214-07082007><SPAN
class=921581821-15082007></DIV></SPAN></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT>
<DIV><FONT><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT size=2><SPAN
class=266220214-07082007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT size=2><SPAN
class=266220214-07082007>When you register, please make sure mentioning "RE:
[BLDG-SIM] Trouble with Heat Pumps (eQuest)" in the text box for comment. Since
the downloading request is still handled manually, it may take a few
days for us to verify your registration and send you a link for
downloading.</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=2><FONT color=#0000ff><SPAN
class=266220214-07082007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=266220214-07082007><SPAN class=921581821-15082007>Hope it could be a small
help for your simulation.</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=266220214-07082007><SPAN
class=921581821-15082007></SPAN></SPAN></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT><FONT color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=266220214-07082007><SPAN
class=921581821-15082007></SPAN></SPAN></FONT></FONT><SPAN
class=266220214-07082007><SPAN class=921581821-15082007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>Xiaobing</FONT></SPAN></DIV></SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma
size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> BLDG-SIM@gard.com
[mailto:BLDG-SIM@gard.com]<B>On Behalf Of </B>Brandon Nichols<BR><B>Sent:</B>
Tuesday, August 07, 2007 5:51 PM<BR><B>To:</B>
BLDG-SIM@gard.com<BR><B>Subject:</B> [BLDG-SIM] Trouble with Heat Pumps
(eQuest)<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=441454922-07082007><FONT
face="Courier New" color=#0000ff size=2>Xiaobing, </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=441454922-07082007><FONT
face="Courier New" color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=441454922-07082007><FONT
face="Courier New" color=#0000ff size=2>Many of us I think would be interested
in the heat pump library. How can it be accessed?</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=441454922-07082007><FONT
face="Courier New" color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=441454922-07082007><FONT
face="Courier New" color=#0000ff size=2>Thanks</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV align=left><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-bidi-font-size: 12.0pt">
<DIV><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-bidi-font-size: 12.0pt"><SPAN
class=212011020-11052004><FONT color=#000000>Brandon Nichols,
PE</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-bidi-font-size: 12.0pt"><SPAN
class=212011020-11052004><FONT
color=#000000>Mechanical</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-bidi-font-size: 12.0pt"><FONT
color=#000080><STRONG>HARGIS ENGINEERS</STRONG></FONT></DIV>
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style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-bidi-font-size: 12.0pt"><FONT
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style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-bidi-font-size: 12.0pt"><FONT
color=#515151>Seattle, WA 98101<o:p></o:p></FONT></SPAN></P>
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style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-bidi-font-size: 12.0pt">d
|</SPAN></B><SPAN
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206.436.04<SPAN class=212011020-11052004>0</SPAN>0<SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN><B>c | </B>206.<SPAN
class=212011020-11052004>228.8707</SPAN></SPAN></P>
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style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-bidi-font-size: 12.0pt"><SPAN
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206.448.3376<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN><B>f <SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>|</B>
206.448.4450</SPAN></FONT></P></SPAN></SPAN>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2></FONT> </DIV></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV><BR>
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left>
<HR tabIndex=-1>
<FONT face=Tahoma size=2><B>From:</B> BLDG-SIM@gard.com
[mailto:BLDG-SIM@gard.com] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Xiaobing Liu<BR><B>Sent:</B>
Monday, August 06, 2007 2:40 PM<BR><B>To:</B>
BLDG-SIM@gard.com<BR><B>Subject:</B> [BLDG-SIM] Trouble with Heat Pumps
(eQuest)<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=643084420-06082007><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2>Karen:</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=643084420-06082007><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=643084420-06082007><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>If
you create a heat pump system using eQUEST wizard, in the first screen of the
wizard system (after you specifying both cooling and heating equipment as "DX
Coil"), an additional input entry will appear and ask you specify the source
of the heat pump. The available options include "Air", "Water Loop", and
"Ground Loop". When "Water Loop" is selected, the HVAC system will be defined
a water loop heat pump (WLHP) system (with boiler and cooling tower); When
"Ground Loop" is selected, the HVAC system will be defined as a ground source
heat pump (GSHP) system that uses water-to-air heat pumps connected to a
common (water) loop and a vertical borehole field as heat sink and
source.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=643084420-06082007><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=643084420-06082007><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>I'm
not clear why you have to deal with HIR for WLHP and GSHP systems since these
heat pumps are electric-driven. I guess you were talking about the EIR instead
of HIR.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=643084420-06082007><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=643084420-06082007><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>The
PVVT is used to simulate the air side of a water-to-air heat pump so that it
can account for the recent developments of water-to-air heat pump, such as the
usage of staged compressor, variable speed fan, etc. If the WLHP/GSHP is
created with the eQUEST wizard, parameters associated with the PVVT system
will be automatically set for constant air flow, and default WLHP/GSHP heat
pump performance curves will be used. The default curves are normalized at the
ARI rating conditions for "ground loop" application (77F EFT for cooling and
32F EFT for heating). If the WSHP/GSHP is created in detailed mode, at this
version of eQUEST, the user has to adjust the parameters of PVVT to
fit for the specific heat pumps being simulated. I've listed some
necessary adjustments for the parameters of PVVT in my earlier post to the
topic "Gshp in detailed edit mode".</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=643084420-06082007><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=643084420-06082007><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>FYI,
a performance data/curve library for all the water-to-air heat pumps of a
major water-source heat pump manufacturer has been built and, as an add-on
feature of eQUEST, it can be accessed directly from the wizard of "Packaged
Equipment" if either WLHP or GSHP is specified. Please let me know if you are
interested in the library and this add-on feature.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=643084420-06082007><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=643084420-06082007><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Hope
it helps in your simulation.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=643084420-06082007><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=643084420-06082007><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2>Xiaobing</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma
size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> BLDG-SIM@gard.com
[mailto:BLDG-SIM@gard.com]<B>On Behalf Of </B>Karen
Walkerman<BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, August 06, 2007 2:57 PM<BR><B>To:</B>
BLDG-SIM@gard.com<BR><B>Cc:</B> BLDG-SIM@gard.com<BR><B>Subject:</B>
[BLDG-SIM] Trouble with Heat Pumps (eQuest)<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV>Thanks for all the responses. I think I figured it out:</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>When you choose "WLHP" in the eQuest Wizard, it creates a PVVT system
with a GSHP. The curve used to adjust HIR is based on a few data
points, and did not perform very well at the temperatures I was using.
A straight HP system selected in detailed edit mode did much better. I
now realize that this is because the HIR curve was better for my
purposes. I have now created curves based on the heat pumps spec'd for
this job and the numbers are making more sense. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Thanks again for all the repsonses, thought I'd let everyone know,
especially because PVVT is what is selected when you create a WLHP system
with the wizard, and may need some detailed data edit tweaking.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>~Karen~<BR><BR> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=gmail_quote>On 8/6/07, <B class=gmail_sendername>Brandon
Nichols</B> <<A
href="mailto:BrandonN@hargis.biz">BrandonN@hargis.biz</A>> wrote:</SPAN>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=gmail_quote
style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">
<DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=e id=q_1143caa839ded31b_1>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>Hello Karen,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>"When so many things can go wrong, almost certainly more than one
of them will go wrong at the same time" ... or something like that,
according to Murphy. Recently I have been wrestling with a large
heat pump system, and may be able to help a little.
</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>Have you adjusted your heat pomp efficiencies? Ground
and water source heat pumps will have different efficiencies, if for no
other reason than they are operating with different condenser water
temperatures. </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>Check this post...</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2><A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)"
href="http://elcca-exchange.blogspot.com/2007/03/ground-water-source-heat-pumps.html"
target=_blank>http://elcca-exchange.blogspot.com/2007/03/ground-water-source-heat-pumps.html</A></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>Next suspect, schedules... don't have a post for that yet, let me
know the effect of efficiency adjustments and we'll go from there.
</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>Regards</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV align=left><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
<DIV><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><SPAN><FONT
color=#000000>Brandon Nichols, PE</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><SPAN><FONT
color=#000000>Mechanical</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><FONT
color=#000080><STRONG>HARGIS ENGINEERS</STRONG></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<P style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><FONT
color=#515151>600 Stewart Street</FONT></SPAN></P>
<P style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><FONT
color=#515151>Suite 1000</FONT></SPAN></P>
<P style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><FONT
color=#515151>Seattle, WA 98101</FONT></SPAN></P>
<P style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><FONT
color=#515151><A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)"
href="http://www.hargis.biz/"
target=_blank>www.hargis.biz</A></FONT></SPAN></P>
<P style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><FONT
color=#515151></FONT></SPAN> </P>
<P style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">d
|</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
206.436.04<SPAN>0</SPAN>0<SPAN> </SPAN><B>c |
</B>206.<SPAN>228.8707</SPAN></SPAN></P>
<P style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><FONT
color=#515151><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">o
|</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: gray; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
206.448.3376<SPAN> </SPAN><B>f <SPAN> </SPAN>|</B>
206.448.4450</SPAN></FONT></P></SPAN>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV><BR>
<DIV lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left>
<HR>
<FONT face=Tahoma size=2><B>From:</B> <A
onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)"
href="mailto:BLDG-SIM@gard.com" target=_blank>BLDG-SIM@gard.com</A>
[mailto:<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)"
href="mailto:BLDG-SIM@gard.com" target=_blank> BLDG-SIM@gard.com</A>]
<B>On Behalf Of </B>Karen Walkerman<BR><B>Sent:</B> Friday, August 03,
2007 5:20 PM<BR><B>To:</B> <A
onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)"
href="mailto:BLDG-SIM@gard.com"
target=_blank>BLDG-SIM@gard.com</A><BR><B>Subject:</B> [BLDG-SIM] Trouble
with Heat Pumps (eQuest)<BR></FONT><BR> </DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV>I apologize for all the emails I've sent out as of late. Thanks
for all the input.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I have another:</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I'm comparing a ground source heat pump to a heat pump loop with
chiller and boiler. Trouble is, when I switch systems, the energy
used by the heat pump to heat the space goes down only slightly as
compared to the energy input by the boiler. My loop temperatures
change between the systems (from heating temp of 40 F to 70 F), and COP
rises accordingly. Right now the energy use of the two systems is
off by about 85%!! </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Energy use for straight electric resistance heat is about the
same as the electric use for a heat pump system. This is for a
baseline model with 18% evenly distributed windows, R-19 batt insulation,
R-38 ceilings, etc. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I used the wizard to set up the equipment for all runs (I'm also
having trouble in detailed edit mode). The water loop and the heat
pump don't seem to be talking to one another. Can anyone help?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Thanks,</DIV>
<DIV><BR clear=all><BR>-- <BR>Karen Walkerman<BR>Second Law
Consulting<BR>802-238-0980<BR><A
onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)"
href="mailto:kwalkerman@gmail.com" target=_blank>kwalkerman@gmail.com
</A></DIV></SPAN></DIV><PRE>You received this e-mail because you are subscribed
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</PRE></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR><BR clear=all><BR>-- <BR>Karen
Walkerman<BR>Second Law Consulting<BR>802-238-0980<BR><A
href="mailto:kwalkerman@gmail.com">kwalkerman@gmail.com</A> </BLOCKQUOTE><PRE>==================
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