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<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=484534118-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2>John,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=484534118-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=484534118-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2>My thought was that we're not so much
cooling and heating the entire space as treating it as a contiguous
entity. Can anyone outside of Scott Criswell say with certainty that air
floors and air ceilings permit connected multifloor spaces to behave
thermodynamically equivalent to multilevel spaces? If so, or Scott if
you're out there, please advise. Since shells can be placed anywhere, it
seems to me there would have to be sophisticated geometrical checking between
spaces within shells to make it work.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=484534118-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=484534118-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2>Admittedly I'm usually modeling
two-level spaces -- gymnasiums cafeterias etc. so perhaps when I
say the method I use produces results that are within expectations, my
expectation bar is set rather low.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=484534118-02072007><FONT face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=484534118-02072007><FONT face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff
size=2>As for underheating, on several projects I have added
baseboards to eliminate the underheating warnings/errors in the simulation
report. While it get the heating load up in the ballpark of
where it needs to be, its not a perfect solution -- but as you say...
deadlines!</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=484534118-02072007><FONT face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=484534118-02072007><FONT face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff
size=2>Brandon</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><BR></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><FONT face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left>
<HR tabIndex=-1>
<FONT face=Tahoma size=2><B>From:</B> Aulbach, John [mailto:jaulbach@nexant.com]
<BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, July 02, 2007 11:33 AM<BR><B>To:</B> Brandon
Nichols<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE: [BLDG-SIM] Museum with multi Story Atriums - Low
airflows..<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=734293018-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>Brandon:</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=734293018-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=734293018-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>That should be "under heating."</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=734293018-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=734293018-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>I have seen your Atrium suggestions before. You seem to be
cooling and heating the entire atrium, which I do not believe is the case,
especially in the 3 story set up.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=734293018-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=734293018-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>I don't have the time to rebuild my model, sad to say.
deadlines..</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left>
<HR tabIndex=-1>
</DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><B>From:</B> Brandon Nichols
[mailto:BrandonN@Hargis.biz] <BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, July 02, 2007 11:20
AM<BR><B>To:</B> Aulbach, John<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE: [BLDG-SIM] Museum with
multi Story Atriums - Low airflows..<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=437090918-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2>Johh,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=437090918-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=437090918-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2>eQuest underestimating
airflows? I suppose the next thing you're going to tell us is that
the polar ice caps are melting! ;-) </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=437090918-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=437090918-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2>FWIW, I build atriums (i.e.
multilevel spaces) a bit differently, see this post:</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=437090918-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=437090918-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2><A
href="http://elcca-exchange.blogspot.com/2007/03/equest-multi-level-spaces.html">http://elcca-exchange.blogspot.com/2007/03/equest-multi-level-spaces.html</A></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=437090918-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=437090918-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=437090918-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2>They seem to work essentially as
expected.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=437090918-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=437090918-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2>Also, I'm not clear on what
you mean exactly by 'overcooking'.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=437090918-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=437090918-02072007><FONT
face="Lucida Console" color=#0000ff size=2>Brandon Nichols,
PE<BR>Mechanical<BR>HARGIS ENGINEERS<BR>600 Stewart St<BR>Suite 1000<BR>Seattle,
WA 98101<BR>d | 206.436.0400 c | 206.228.8707<BR>o | 206.448.3376 f |
206.448.4450<BR><A
href="http://www.hargis.biz">www.hargis.biz</A><BR></FONT></SPAN></DIV><BR>
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left>
<HR tabIndex=-1>
<FONT face=Tahoma size=2><B>From:</B> BLDG-SIM@gard.com
[mailto:BLDG-SIM@gard.com] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Aulbach, John<BR><B>Sent:</B>
Monday, July 02, 2007 10:33 AM<BR><B>To:</B>
BLDG-SIM@gard.com<BR><B>Subject:</B> [BLDG-SIM] Museum with multi Story Atriums
- Low airflows..<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>Hi Gang:</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>I am modeling a brand new multi story museum in eQuest in a
4 season climate. The Museum has several atriums, some two story and some three
story. I have been making the atriums vertically multizoned, removing the floors
and ceilings, and creating airwalls between the atriums levels. I
have conditioned all bottom atrium floors, conditioned the 2nd floors of the 3
story atriums, but have left the top floors of ALL atriums
unconditioned.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>My difficulties are twofold:</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>1) This is to be an eventual LEED application, so ASHRAE
90.1-2004 is the base building. This requires eQuest sized airflows for a 20 Deg
delta T, coil to room temperature.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>This is resulting in airflows that are 60% down to 30% of
what the Design shows.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>2) I also seem to undercooking many of the spaces,
including the atriums.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>Am I modeling these atriums
correctly?</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>I don't have much time to make changes, so any help is
greatly appreciated.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007>
<DIV align=left>
<DIV align=left><FONT color=#0000ff>John R. Aulbach, PE, CEM</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=left><FONT face=Arial size=2><EM>Project Manager</EM></FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=left><FONT face=Arial size=2><FONT color=#0000ff>Nexant,
Inc</FONT>.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=left><FONT face=Arial size=2>100 North Barranca, Suite
820</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=left><FONT face=Arial size=2>West Covina, CA 91791 USA</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=left><FONT face=Arial size=2>Phone: 626-430-9054</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=left><FONT face=Arial size=2>Fax: 626-430-9060</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=left><FONT face=Arial size=2>email: <A
title=mailto:jaulbach@nexant.com
href="mailto:jaulbach@nexant.com">jaulbach@nexant.com</A></FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=702311517-02072007><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV><PRE>==================
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