[Bldg-sim] Expert advice to show minimum efficiency compliance Table 6.8.1C [1 Attachment]
Nicholas Caton
Nicholas.Caton at schneider-electric.com
Wed Mar 7 13:20:11 PST 2018
I think Javed’s situation is most easily explained by mapping out some of our industry’s terminology, as I can see the discussion going in many directions as we reply to each other – If there’s one thing I’ve found consistent between great engineers, it’s probably *not* consistency of terminology (much less, between languages). With that, I’m certain some regions and individuals will disagree with parts of the following mapping, but hopefully this will help guide the majority:
* What cooling medium is piped between the chiller and condenser equipment?
* Refrigerant --> “Air-cooled chiller” (in AHRI 550/590 & 90.1 terms)
* In the case of air-cooled chillers, the condenser is simply referred to as the condenser.
* I have not personally run into commercial/spec-grade refrigerant-circulating condensers that pre-cool the air with sprayers/misting. I’m aware they exist, but I’m not familiar with how to distinguish this feature… I guess I would call it “evaporative cooling add-on” or “evaporative preconditioning”
* This is a 3rd party solution a colleague of mine investigated once, but didn’t make it into the project scope: http://www.evaporcool.com/
* Water --> “Water-cooled chiller” (in AHRI 550/590 & 90.1 terms)
* This includes water with add-mixtures, like glycol
* Is the condenser water loop closed, or exposed to air?
* Open Loop --> “Cooling Tower”
* Closed Loop --> “Fluid cooler”
* Terminology usage grows particularly loose here between different manufacturers and specifiers --> Best to grab a datasheet to confirm what exactly you’re dealing with
* Is water sprayed on the fluid cooler’s fins to induce evaporative cooling?
* No --> “Dry cooler” or “Radiator”
* Yes --> “Evaporative Fluid Cooler” or “Indirect Evaporative Cooler” or “Closed Loop Cooling Tower”
With that mapping, I’m inclined to agree that Javed is dealing with a combination of “Dry coolers” and “Evaporative Fluid Coolers,” both of which I’d expect to be paired with water-cooled chillers. The image below leads me to feel it’s hydronic/water fluid cooling in lieu of refrigerant because:
1. The headers on the end (copper color) appear to be equally sized pipes – if it were refrigerant I’d expect one to be narrower
2. I don’t see the condensers anywhere… it’s possible they could be remote and I’m wrong however.
I’d still advise Javed to seek out some literature / cutsheets to be certain of what the cooling medium is. I can’t be 100% certain only looking at the picture.
Hope this helps someone!
~Nick
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Nick Caton, P.E., BEMP
Senior Energy Engineer
Regional Energy Engineering Manager
Energy and Sustainability Services
Schneider Electric
D 913.564.6361
M 785.410.3317
F 913.564.6380
E nicholas.caton at schneider-electric.com<mailto:nicholas.caton at schneider-electric.com>
15200 Santa Fe Trail Drive
Suite 204
Lenexa, KS 66219
United States
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On Mon, Mar 5, 2018 at 10:47 PM, Javed Iqbal via Bldg-sim <bldg-sim at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:bldg-sim at lists.onebuilding.org>> wrote:
Hello,
I would appreciate your expert advice on selecting 90.1-2010 Baseline system to show minimum efficiency compliance as given under Table 6.8.1C. One of the proposed project i am working on has two Chillers
1. One with Std. Dry Coolers
2. Second chiller has special arrangement where the surrounding air of cooling tower being cooled (dry bulb) by some sort of misting to increase the dry cooler effectiveness during extreme outdoor condition (CZ5A) ~ 80% lower water consumption compared to typical water cooled cooling tower. In this hybrid cooling tower, evaporation effect is happening but not like std. water cooled cooling tower.
To show minimum efficiency compliance, what condenser type do i need to choose; Air or Water Cooled in both the Cooling tower type; Std Dry cooler and Hybrid Dry cooler (see image below)? Also find an attachment to have more info
on the product.
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Thank you so much.
regards,
--
Javed Iqbal, LEED AP, CEA
Sr. Energy Analyst
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